Atheists: Don't deny your God!!

MartinM · #51 10th April 2003, 08:43 PM

[b]Today at 01:33 AM lucaspa said this in Post #46 More than most, [scientists] are content to live with unanswered questions[b/]

I would say that this is only true, if at all, for questions which cannot be answered through scientific method.

The second is because to dismiss belief in God summarily is to pass premature and unwarranted judgement on the sanity, honesty, and intelligence of a vast number of our fellow human beings who claim to have such experiential evidence, many of them the same persons we do trust implicitly when it comes to other matters

Argumentum ad populum. In any case, just because I don't believe in God doesn't mean I dismiss the possibility altogether.

Willowolf · #52 10th April 2003, 08:45 PM

Lucaspa, The Bible is God's Word. No where in the Bible does it say God created an evolutionary process.
Genesis 1:21
" And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good."

God Created and they were. Notice it says He created "after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind..."
God didn't create one or a few simple creatures and allow them to evolve into the existing kinds.

If you accept evolution you deny God, you are therefore an atheist.

God Bless, Willowolf

MartinM · #53 10th April 2003, 08:46 PM

Today at 01:35 AM Willowolf said this in Post #47

Hey, you don't have to believe me! But.....the consequence of your unbelief still stand.
Ogdar the Mighty, Overlord of the Seventh-and-a-half Plane of Overbearing Flamingoes, loves you MartinM, he gives you this chance to accept Him.
Will you deny Him?

Arikay · #54 10th April 2003, 08:47 PM

Willow: A question.

If I came up to you and said, "Accept Odin as your true god, and live in eternal happyness, dont except him and you will burn in eternal pain, you have only one chance to save yourself."

Would you accept "odin" ?

Why or why not?

MartinM · #55 10th April 2003, 08:49 PM

Today at 01:45 AM Willowolf said this in Post #52 Lucaspa, The Bible is God's Word. No where in the Bible does it say God created an evolutionary process

Nor, in fact, does it give any details whatsoever of how God created.

God didn't create one or a few simple creatures and allow them to evolve into the existing kinds

It's not logically possible to derive that statement from the quote you gave without a rigourous definition of 'kind'. Got one?

Come to think of it, it doesn't follow even with the definition.

Arikay · #56 10th April 2003, 08:50 PM

So, Willow, can you tell us what a "kind" is? Like, why is one "kind" different from another?

The interesting part though is that you just called the majority of christians atheists.

Today at 05:45 PM Willowolf said this in Post #52

Lucaspa, The Bible is God's Word. No where in the Bible does it say God created an evolutionary process.
Genesis 1:21
" And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good."

God Created and they were. Notice it says He created "after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind..."
God didn't create one or a few simple creatures and allow them to evolve into the existing kinds.

If you accept evolution you deny God, you are therefore an atheist.

God Bless, Willowolf

The Thadman · #57 10th April 2003, 08:52 PM

When you sit down and think about it, there are MANY religious beliefs out there, and I have yet to meet someone who clings to less than two.

With each position, be it Christianity, Athiesm, Creationism, Evolution, Abortion, etc., there are sets of logic, and there are sets of axioms they boil down to that are unproveable.

Logically speaking, logic is, logically, illogical. It defines itself, and according to logical principles, that's a circular definition (it's a fallacy).

One can't truly say that they 'Lack belief,' but they can say that they reject other beliefs (ie, for an Athiest, they actively reject any belief in God and/or gods; for Christians, we actively reject the belief that there is no God; etc.).

Why? They all boil down, no matter what the stance :-)

Shlomo!
(Peace!)

Willowolf · #58 10th April 2003, 08:56 PM

Hey Arikay
I wouldn't accept "odin" because
He isn't eternal
He didn't create the universe and all that is therein
He didn't create me
He didn't help humanity as God helped his chosen people Israel
He didn't send His only son to die on the cross for my sins
He didn't give us his holy word the Bible
He doesn't answer prayers
He doesn't intercede on my behalf before the throne of God
He isn't preparing a place for me in heaven
He isn't coming back for me one day

God Bless, Willowolf

MartinM · #59 10th April 2003, 08:59 PM

Today at 01:52 AM The Thadman said this in Post #57 When you sit down and think about it, there are MANY religious beliefs out there, and I have yet to meet someone who clings to less than two

Only if you stretch the definiton of religion so far as to be meaningless...

With each position, be it Christianity, Athiesm, Creationism, Evolution, Abortion, etc., there are sets of logic, and there are sets of axioms they boil down to that are unproveable

...like this! Congratulations, you just defined 1 + 1 = 2 to be a religious statement.

Logically speaking, logic is, logically, illogical. It defines itself, and according to logical principles, that's a circular definition (it's a fallacy)

Logic doesn't define itself, its axioms define it. The fallacies are statements derived from those axioms, so they can't be applied to them. The best you could do is show that a particular set of axioms is inconsistent.

One can't truly say that they 'Lack belief,' but they can say that they reject other beliefs (ie, for an Athiest, they actively reject any belief in God and/or gods; for Christians, we actively reject the belief that there is no God; etc.)

Again, you're redefining belief to be so wide as to catch just about anything. And even that won't deal with agnosticism.

Zadok001 · #60 10th April 2003, 08:59 PM

"If you accept evolution you deny God, you are therefore an atheist."

Wow.

Frying pan, fire, the intermediary leap between them.

Willowolf: There are many things the Bible doesn't say that you believe in. You believe, for example, that when you hit "K" on your keyboard, a "K" will appear on the screen. Find a passage in the Bible confirming that. No such luck? So why deny evolution?

Look. I know you believe in God, and Jesus, and whatever else your interpretation of the Bible leads you to believe. You're convinced you're right. I'm pretty well convinced that your reading of the Bible is no more an authority on the nature of reality than Martha Stewart's reading of "Alice In Wonderland." Now, why should I take you assertions as to the nature of reality seriously? I don't presently believe the Bible is the work of God. If it IS the work of God, you can convince me otherwise. Proving YECism would be a start. Giving me my 32-digit number would work as well.

1. I do not believe in God.
2. Certain events could convince me of the existance of God.
3. God is capable of making these events come about, being omnipotent.
4. If God wanted these events to come about, they would.
5. These events have not come about.
6. Therefore, God does not want me to believe in him.