Creation & EvolutionForum for the discussion of this important topic. This forum is open to non-believers. There is a Christians-only forum in the Christians-only section too.
2nd April 2003 at 08:34 PM PhantomLlama said this in Post #3
I was a lurker for a few months. I enjoyed reading the posts so much I became a member. Don't give up! You are at least slowing the flow of new creationists even if you are unsucessful in deprogramming existing bigots.
These discussions have honed my rhetoric and shapened my research skills. And they have given me an insight into the creationist dementia. Creationists are people with very weak religious convictions. They have filled their ignorance with their idols, and threatening that ignorance threatens their smugly self-assured salvation. Not for these is that ultimate leap of faith. Drowning in a scientific flood of Noachian proportions, they will not learn to swim but continue to cling hysterically to their holy book even as it draws them ever deeper into their abysmal self-deception. They are afraid. It is that simple.
__________________ "A belief which leaves no place for doubt is not a belief; it is a superstition." - Jose Bergamin
"You can't trust an honest man." --- Anonymous
"He does not believe who does not live according to his belief." -- Thomas Fuller
"The fact that the author thinks slowly is not serious, but the fact that he publishes faster than he thinks is inexcusable." -- Wolfgang Pauli
"He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?" -- Micah 6:8
"It is because we believe absurdities that we are able to commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
"This isn't right. This isn't even wrong." -- Wolfgang Pauli
"Je ne suis pas marxiste." -- Karl Marx
"Faith is believing what you know ain't so."-- Mark Twain
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein
These discussions have honed my rhetoric and shapened my research skills
I feel the same...it has even spilled to my real life. I am always asking people to back up their claims, or point me to a study or whatever, even on non-important issues. I told my company's CEO the other day I didn't feel he had made his case in regards to a decision and until he laid out his reasoning in a logical manner I wouldn't support it...I NEVER would have done that before I began debating (BTW, he atually rethought the decision and changed his mind ). My critical thinking and skepticism have been honed too and are serving me well.
Hopefully lurkers have learned a lot of information about the um "debate" between evolution and creationism. But even more, I hope it has taught people to think for themselves and to not blindly accept things just because they Want them to be right.
I have learned an enormous amount from these debates... I would hate to see them stop. One of the main things I've learned is how to research and how to debate effectively.
I've spent many hours reading the talkorignins website and USENET.
I wish the likes of Jerry Smith, Morat and Rufus Atticus (and many others) posted more.
I'll also say that reading and participating somewhat on these boards have changed my attitude on what is acceptable and not acceptable when having discussion on these issues.
My problem is that some friends I have these conversations with refuse to engage with me now...The bar is pretty high nowand most of them don't want to go that high.
I guess im also a lurker, but I am really interested in this debate. Ever since I found out that creationists still exist I've had a massive increase in my knowledge of biology, physics and cosmology. Its entertaining too.
I think that is unfair Grahccus. I am a christian, but definately not a YEC believer. But in my experience most YECs are kind and Godly people who trust God's Word. But, in my opinion, they get trust in its truth mixed up with trusting it to be a literal science or history book, which it was not meant to be in all places (although I think much of it is a relatively literal historical account). I think the greatest concern of most YECs is not fear but love, and they lovingly try to protect people's faith and trust in the Bible from what they see as a worldly attack with potentially disasterous consequences. I think this concern is misplaced, but I value it non the less.
__________________
"Wherefore say, Behold, I give unto him my covenant of peace:
And he shall have it, and his seed after him, even the covenant of an everlasting priesthood; because he was zealous for his God,
and made an atonement for the children of Israel."
Num 25:12-13 [KJV]
I feel the same...it has even spilled to my real life. I am always asking people to back up their claims, or point me to a study or whatever, even on non-important issues. I told my company's CEO the other day I didn't feel he had made his case in regards to a decision and until he laid out his reasoning in a logical manner I wouldn't support it...I NEVER would have done that before I began debating (BTW, he atually rethought the decision and changed his mind ). My critical thinking and skepticism have been honed too and are serving me well.
I agree, it has helped my debating aresearching skills too. I don't accept things as easily as I used too, I need evidence.
__________________ "Ach, stick it up yer trakkans!"
3rd April 2003 at 05:44 AM Gracchus said this in Post #12
These discussions have honed my rhetoric and shapened my research skills. And they have given me an insight into the creationist dementia. Creationists are people with very weak religious convictions. They have filled their ignorance with their idols, and threatening that ignorance threatens their smugly self-assured salvation. Not for these is that ultimate leap of faith. Drowning in a scientific flood of Noachian proportions, they will not learn to swim but continue to cling hysterically to their holy book even as it draws them ever deeper into their abysmal self-deception. They are afraid. It is that simple.
So you come all the way to the Christian Forum to slander the Christian Faith. Nice motive. Seems like a paranoia of religion.
If anyone is afraid it seems to be you.
Science has not disproved God so you falsifying God is unsound and you can offer no proof that God does not exist.
Last edited by webboffin; 3rd April 2003 at 09:43 PM.
). My critical thinking and skepticism have been honed too and are serving me well. 
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