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Ok, I deleted that last post of mine because I hadn't noticed this thread had more than one page.
But one point I brought up in it is still relevant. Jon, you keep citing "The ark could have sailed around the world several times" as a useful explanation. It's meaningless. I'm rather suprised you don't see this.
Ark with a bunch of animals sails around the world several times. A year later, Ark lands, Noah and Co. hop off. How does this explan ANY biogeography? As Noah sailed past Australia, he put his kangaroo pair in Scuba gear and dropped 'em off. After all, the world is STILL FLOODED! He can't just let them out the back door as he passes, unless they care to swim for a year or so.
So, what is this "sailed around the world several times" claim supposed to mean?
__________________ --Zadok001, aka Greater Good fanatic
1st April 2003 at 02:41 AM Jon said this in Post #12 During a one year flood the ark could have floated around the world several times.
Mr. Hovind throws this little jewel out rather cavalierly, and Jon repeated it so I'm assuming he agrees with it. My question is this, what are the chances that a large boat could circumnavigate the world once, much less several times, in one year? And where in the Bible is this supposed circumnavigation described? All this given that fact that this boat had no propulsion system(sails, a motor, oars) that I've ever heard of.
In addition, I find it strange that the Bible felt no need to mention the fact that Noah traveled the globe hand delivering millions of species to the far corners of the earth. It seems noteworthy given that this little errand would take him years and he would have been on the boat with all of those animals even longer than the YEC's have previously proposed. So now Noah needed to provide food and waste disposal for several years on one boat? Seems that the more we try to reconcile the flood story with reality, the more absurd we have to get.
Unfortunatly there are many things that the YECs add to the bible to make their story seem closer to correct. Like the supposed upheval of all the mountains after (or during) the flood. Both of which would have either beached the ark, or killed all the animals. Besides the fact that its not mentioned in the bible.
So YECs how does biogeography fit nicely into a young earth framework? I am still waiting for an answer that actually makes some sense.
The Frumious Bandersnatch
__________________ A little Learning is a dang'rous Thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian Spring:
There shallow Draughts intoxicate the Brain,
And drinking largely sobers us again.
A lot of Christians on this board are intimidated by not being able to answer or even understand some of the evidence presented here in favor of an old earth and/or evolution
The evidence on this thread is very easy to understand and should not intimidate anyone. It does falsify the worldwide flood myth in a very straightforward way so I thought I would bump it up.
BTW don't feel too bad Truth in Faith, even the people who understand the evidence very well can't defend the worldwide flood against those who know the science involved.
The Frumious Bandersnatch
__________________ A little Learning is a dang'rous Thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian Spring:
There shallow Draughts intoxicate the Brain,
And drinking largely sobers us again.
I am glad to see the board back up. It must have been a LOT of work. Thanks.
I thought I would make my first post on the restored board by bumping this thread back up. In nearly three months of trying YEC were not able to come up with a worldwide flood based explanation that makes any sense at all. Have any of you consider that reason that biogeography does not fit a worldwide flood is that there was no worldwide flood?
The Frumious Bandersnatch
PS(Added in edit)It looks like this might be the first post restoration post on this forum. How about that! BTW my old bookmark that took me direct to the forum no longer works. http://www.christianforums.com/forums/70.html
In nearly three months of trying YEC were not able to come up with a worldwide flood based explanation that makes any sense at all. Have any of you consider that reason that biogeography does not fit a worldwide flood is that there was no worldwide flood?
That is not true at all. Science has established that there was world wide flooding that began at the end of the last major ice age. That fits right into a YEC model of a day of creation being 1000 years.
According to the GAP theory, by the end of the last ice age, God had destroyed most but not all of life on the earth. (remenant theology) He than began all over again, making a literal interpretation of Genesis Chapter one to be a true interpretation.
Noah's flood was local in that it was in the Tigris Euphrates river valley. But it was also a part of the world wide flooding that we see up to today. As the ice continues to melt and areas in the world continue to flood and go underwater. Even though no exact mechanism for this is understood, although it does tend to follow global warming and cooling.
That is not true at all. Science has established that there was world wide flooding that began at the end of the last major ice age. That fits right into a YEC model of a day of creation being 1000 years.
According to the GAP theory, by the end of the last ice age, God had destroyed most but not all of life on the earth. (remenant theology) He than began all over again, making a literal interpretation of Genesis Chapter one to be a true interpretation.
Noah's flood was local in that it was in the Tigris Euphrates river valley. But it was also a part of the world wide flooding that we see up to today. As the ice continues to melt and areas in the world continue to flood and go underwater. Even though no exact mechanism for this is understood, although it does tend to follow global warming and cooling.
John, "world-wide flood" in this case means water that covered all the land on all the planet, not rising sea levels all over the world.
Gap Theory doesn't work because most life on earth was not destroyed at the end of the Ice Age. The only life that was really lost were the large mammals, and humans did most of them in by overhunting. But there is no record of extinction in Africa or the Phillipines or the Amazon rainforests, for example.
Also, you can't get a literal interpretation of Genesis 1 from Gap Theory, because, as you acknowledge, the sun, moon, and stars were already in place before the Ice Age, yet they are created de novo in Genesis 1.
That is not true at all. Science has established that there was world wide flooding that began at the end of the last major ice age. That fits right into a YEC model of a day of creation being 1000 years.
John,
Worldwide flooding is NOT the same as a worldwide flood we have been over this before I am sure. The biogeography question is not a problem for a local flood even if there was other widespread local flooding at the same time. As Lucas has pointed out YEC clearly calls for a worldwide flood that covers the entire world with water. YECs claim that representatives of every "kind" of animal were on the ark and that they all came off the ark at the same time in the Middle East. There are many falsifications of this model and biogeography is one of them. It has NOTHING TO DO with your claims of worldwide local flooding which are completely OFF TOPIC for this thread. The only relevance of flooding at the end of the last ice age is that it would clearly close off any land bridges. YECs claim that a single ice age (there have been many but that's yet another topic) came AFTER the flood and some try to use ice age land bridges to explain biogeography. I have explained in detail why this fails.
If you want to discuss worldwide flooding which is different from a worldwide flood please do so in another thread.
--Zadok001] 
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