Do Disbelievers Go Too Hell?

mike1reynolds · #**121** 4th May 2006, 04:49 PM

Since MLK’s message has been watered down and neutralized almost as much as Jesus’, I should provide some context here. MLK didn’t just preach against bigotry, he was a disciple of Gandhi. Gandhi invented the path of non-violent action. In Hindi it is called Ahimsa – peaceful action. That his how he was able to free India from British rule. MLK went to India and became a disciple of Gandhi’s, studying at one of his ashrams. It is only by embracing the parallel truths of other religions that MLK was able to preach the gospel in the manner that he did.

Melethiel · #**122** 4th May 2006, 04:51 PM

Did you ask anyone the specific question: Is belief that all non-Christians go too Hell a form of religious bigotry?

It doesn’t sound like it. It sounds like you gave them reams of paper and asked them a question that has nothing to do with the assertion.

Even in the face of opposing evidence, you deny it...I instant messaged them this thread, along with the direct question. The answer was contrary to your assertions.

Then why do have such a strong conviction that calling this bigotry is preaching a false gospel?

I think that you have a misunderstanding about what is being debated here. You have bought into Lynns misrepresentation of my argument so much so that you don’t really have any idea of what it is that I am actually saying.

Convictions mean nothing.
I understand perfectly well what you are arguing, and I reject it. I have been reading YOUR posts, not Lynn's.

There is strong correlation, this is incontrovertible. Whether or not it is a cause and effect relationship is irrelevant to this incontrovertible fact (although the argument that there is no cause and effect relationship is pretty weak).

You have provided no evidence that there is a strong correlation. You have given two unrelated facts and attempted to link them. Now, if you provided statistics saying that all those in Europe who attend church have a lower IQ than those who do not, you might have an argument. However, that is simply not true.

There is no proof of anything outside of mathematics, but the evidence is quite strong. It is a unanimous trend in all industrial nations except former Soviet countries. You can’t go below zero, so that fact that it isn’t going down there is not evidence of very much.

If you study history, you will find that things like religious attendance go in periodic cycles. There have been many periods of seeming apostacy followed by revival.

Melethiel · #**123** 4th May 2006, 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by mike1reynolds

Since MLK’s message has been watered down and neutralized almost as much as Jesus’, I should provide some context here. MLK didn’t just preach against bigotry, he was a disciple of Gandhi. Gandhi invented the path of non-violent action. In Hindi it is called Ahimsa – peaceful action. That his how he was able to free India from British rule. MLK went to India and became a disciple of Gandhi’s, studying at one of his ashrams. It is only by embracing the parallel truths of other religions that MLK was able to preach the gospel in the manner that he did.

PPR.

Lynn73 · #**124** 4th May 2006, 04:53 PM

Originally Posted by mike1reynolds

If they are overwhelmed with false bigoted distortions of Jesus' teachings then they have not rejected Christ, they have rejected a false gospel.

The definition of bigotry in the dictionary is: being intolerantly convinced of one’s opinion.

Your distortion of the gospel fits the definition precisely. Islam is also a bigoted religion. This is the reason why these are the two most violent religions in the world. That is one of the many factors that turn people off from a false hateful gospel. The True gospel is one of compassion and mercy which you vehemently reject.

You prove once again, friend, that you don't listen. There's only one truth and what you're espousing isn't it. The true gospel is BECAUSE of God's compassion and mercy but the fact is still that there is only one way for everyone and that is faith in Christ. Those outside of Christ are lost. If you don't like that, take it up with God because He's the one who says so. Your view of Christianity and the gospel of Christ is distorted perhaps due to your studying of all these different false religions. Studying what they believe is fine, as long as their error and falsehood is recognized. As I said, there aren't many truths, you can't go smorgasboarding in different religions, including Christianity, and just pick out what you like and make up a religion from that. Not if you want to remain in the truth. If you want the whole truth, again, read the Scriptures, and forget Ghandi and all these other religions. They're false.

Lynn73 · #**125** 4th May 2006, 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by mike1reynolds

Lynn, BarbB, and Melethiel, do you think that Martin Luther King was preaching a false gospel?

I don't know that much about him but what little I know makes me think that preaching the gospel of Christ wasn't what he was all about. He seemed to be more about reform and working to see blacks treated equally with everyone else. This is commendable, but it isn't the gospel.

mike1reynolds · #**126** 4th May 2006, 05:01 PM

How do I admit multiple truths? I accept only one truth. Your is not an equally valid interpretation, it is false. Jesus was not a bigot.

mike1reynolds · #**127** 4th May 2006, 05:04 PM

MLK was a preacher who talked extensively about Jesus and used Biblical passages to justify his actions. According to you his whole approach was contrary to the Bible. He adopted it from another religion.

mike1reynolds · #**128** 4th May 2006, 05:12 PM

All true religions teach exactly the same precepts. Just because other religions are older and so could not have made reference to Jesus in their scriptures doesn’t make their lack of scriptural reference to Jesus a source of invalidation. All Hindus, for example, embrace Jesus as a messiah. Their term for messiah is “avatar” and they all believe that Jesus was the last avatar. They avidly study the life of Jesus and are intimately familiar with Him. For example, when The Passion of Christ came out, it was a huge block buster in India. People lined up around the block waiting for hours to get in to see it, like you would only see for a rock concert in this country. They arguably love Jesus much more than most Americans.

Debi1967 · #**129** 4th May 2006, 05:19 PM

Originally Posted by Lynn73

Mike, as someone else suggested, I also suggest you carefully and slowly reread the New Testament. You are, indeed, preachng a false gospel here and it very well may be YOU that is going to have to answer for it and for all those you may lead astray by it. I'd be very careful about changing the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ if I were you. I concur with Melethiel, you are calling the true gospel and the God of that gospel to be full of bigotry.

And it doesn't matter how "selflessly loving" atheists are. On the authority of Scripture, they will still go to hell if they continue rejecting Christ, God's only provision for anyone's salvation.

Wow this is twice in one day that I am agreeing with Lynn what is happening here ??????

Sorry Mike, I usually like what you have to say but in this instance and in this thread you are preaching UNIVERSALISM and that is not spoken of in the Bible ...

mike1reynolds · #**130** 4th May 2006, 05:45 PM

You are Catholic, right? What do you think of the works of Father Thomas Merton?

The Bible teaches that the pagan gods where in fact demons. But if you assume that this applies to monotheistic religions I think it is an overgeneralization. Islam is a different story, but other monotheistic religions do not share the characteristics of paganism.

In Biblical times they had no contact with any other monotheistic religion, so their lack of reference to them doesn't preclude them.