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Bibliology & Hermeneutics The study of the Bible and Scriptures, and its interpretation and translation.

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  #101  
Old 16th January 2003, 10:50 AM
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Is every word of God important, to God, to YOU?
It certainly is! That's why I'm glad that the modern translations have restored closer translations of God's word rather than obscuring it behind made-up terms like "sodomite".

-Chris
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  #102  
Old 16th January 2003, 11:05 AM
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Jep,

I believe that in your zeal to defend the modern versions, you are not interested in the facts of the matter, at least not at this point. Perhaps one day a brother or sister will show you something that will blow your mind like how the NIV calls Satan Jesus in Isaiah or how Mark 1:2-3 in the NIV is wrong or how the NIV strips away some of the most important verses concerning the Deity of Jesus Christ . But then again, that would require that you listen.
Every once in a while, I find a need to repost my testimony from being a NIV user to KJV only advocate & back to NIV.

 

When I first accepted Christ as my Lord & Saviour in 1979, I bought an NIV Bible. A couple of years later after reading material from Jack Chick I went to the KJV. For 17 years I was a KJV only advocate. During that time I read books from David Otis Fuller, Peter Ruckman (even then I had a hard time w/ some of his conclusions) etc. To me it was an open & shut case. It was KJV all the way. Around 1998 I started reading books from the other side of the fence (modern versions advocates), to see if what I was reading in my pro KJV books was accurate, cause I would always read the rebuttals of these "anti KJV" books that come out, but I've never read any of the "anti KJV" books. I wasn't totally convinced of their (the pro modern versions advocates) arguments, but some of their points I could understand. I also noticed that they were not the Bible denying heretical apostates, worshipping at the feet of Wescott & Hort that some were declaring them to be. During this time I finally came across a downloadable version of "The King James Version Defended" by Edward F. Hills. I have wanted to get this book for quite a long time but was just not able to find it. When I got to the chapters dealing with manuscript evidence and the TR, he was stating things that was opposite of what I had been lead to believe, and confirming what I was reading in the books written by the modern versions advocates. By this time I was totally questioning the KJV only position. A Christian brother at work gave me a copy of Gail Riplinger's book "New Age Bible Versions" to read (This book I remember seeing in the local Christian bookstore, but never bothered to get, because at that time I had so many pro-KJV books that I felt that I didn't need another one). I read it, & couldn't believe the conclusions she was comming to. When I would read her quotes from other sources, I realized that I had some of the books she was quoting from, and when I checked them out, I found that she mis-quoted, or completely taken out of context, or even made up statements to prove her position. Even some of her Bible verse comparisons were wrong. At that moment I realized how flawed the KJV only position really was. I went out to Borders bookstore and bought an NIV Bible. I remember when I gave the Gail Riplinger book back to my friend at work and he asked me what I thought of it (he was & still is KJV only), I told him that I thought that it was the worst book I have ever seen to come out promoting the KJV only position, and because of it I went out and bought an NIV. He looked at me dumb founded , and couldn't believe that I could come to such a conclusion. So now I endorse the NIV, NASB, & KJV, etc. because they all are the Word of God. I especially endorse the NIV because it captures the spirit of what the KJV translators set out to do when they published their Bible version.

And through this God speaks to me with such freshness and clarity that every time I open the pages of this God ordained sacred book, my spirit is renewed by the awesome presense of the Lord. Praise the Name of Jesus.
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  #103  
Old 16th January 2003, 11:16 AM
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KJV Matt. 18:11
For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost

NIVMatt. 18:11
Nothing...it's all missing...gone

KJVCol 2:18
Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his flesly mind.

NIVCol 2:18
Do not let anyone who delights in false humility and the worship of angels disqualify you for the prize. Such a person goes into great detail about what he hath seen, and his unspiritual mind puffs him up with idle notions.
  #104  
Old 16th January 2003, 12:13 PM
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Re: Every word of God is important!

Originally posted by Jephunneh
Why is it that the word "sodomite" is not in the NIV?
Because it's not in God's word. The original text says nothing about Sodom in any place where the KJV uses Sodomite. As Isaiah and Ezekiel clearly state, Sodom's sin was inhospitality. At a later time, when gang-raping strangers to show dominance was a forgotten relic of the Bronze Age, people came up with a new explanation of the Sodom story, and went around mistranslating other things as "sodomite".

If you learn a little Hebrew, you'll probably find that it's most often a translation of "qadesh", which is translated in some translations as "the unclean", and refers to temple prostitutes that cults in the area had, and which were (justifiably, I think) viewed by the Hebrews as anathema.

So, it has nothing at all to do with Sodom, and God's inspired word never said it did.

But hey, if you want to take a 12th-century urban legend as an improvement on God's inspired word, you go right ahead.
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. I affirm the Nicene Creed.

For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. -- Romans 8:38-39
  #105  
Old 21st January 2003, 12:04 PM
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King James BIBLE
If it ain’t broke...don’t fix it..
.
Repentance (Matthew 9:13)
KJV-... for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance.

NIV-... for I have not come to call
the righteous, but sinners.

NASV-... For I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners.
  #106  
Old 21st January 2003, 12:48 PM
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"If it ain't broke, don't fix it"

So why, then, does the KJV rely on manuscripts which have added to God's word in cases like this? Can't God speak for himself?

-Chris
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  #107  
Old 22nd January 2003, 11:25 AM
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Jeph, please stop posting your verse comparisons that seem to harp on pseudo-biblical material and focus on what people ask of you. They're purely irrelevant because they are not proving your point, and frankly, they're making you look bad in terms of you knowledge of textual criticism (which is something that I think isn't fair).

We're here to learn, not bash eachother over the head, and if you can take the time to actually consider other people's points and reply to them with Christian scholarship, my respect for you will soar (and I'm not kidding).

Shlomo! (Peace!)
  #108  
Old 22nd January 2003, 01:13 PM
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Here is one reason why the Authorized Version of the Holy Bible is superior
to any Greek text, or any Greek manuscripts:

And that is because it is in the universal language of the end time.
Greek, as a language, is deader than last year's bird nest.
It constitutes less than one percent of the world's spoken languages, and there is no demand for it anywhere on earth, except in Greece, and in the back rooms of dead, orthodox, conservative, Bible critics.
  #109  
Old 22nd January 2003, 01:17 PM
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But the "Authorized Version" is based on the Greek manuscripts! When the "Authorized Version" and the NIV (or whatever version) disagree, we must return to the Greek sources to see what the correct translation is.

Because that's what the KJV is -- a *translation*.

-Chris
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  #110  
Old 22nd January 2003, 01:30 PM
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Love How Important is The Bible TO YOU?

Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. John 17:17




God has used the KJV because it is His Word, which He has

providentially watched over. Even though the KJV only goes back to 1611,

nevertheless it is based upon the text and versions which preceded it.

These texts and manuscripts are the ones that Bible believers have used

down through the ages. It is a known fact that 85% to 95% of all ancient

manuscripts are in basic agreement with the KJV, but not with the modern

versions.
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