Dividing the waters from the waters

In the Creation story, God creates the "firmament". The firmament is a solid structure which is placed in high heaven so that the "waters" above (the sky) won't come crashing down on us. Here's a picture:



Genesis 1:6 (this is from the KJV):

"And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters."

As you can see, the ancient Hebrews clearly believed that the sky was made out of water, and a firmament in the midst of the waters held it up.

Is this true? Or, perhaps, is Genesis 1:6 an primitive way of explaining the way the sky looks? (Creationists only, please.)

Although what you describe is a good, valid interpretation of what the Hebrew might be saying, it is by no means the only interpretation, since the Hebrew words used have several valid meanings.

For example, the Hebrew hammayim most commonly is translated as water, which is the way the KJV translates it. However, it can also mean a chaotic mixture--and you will find that some of the most respected Jewish biblical scholars (writing 700-1200 years ago, which is well before modern scientific discoveries) believed that chaotic mixture was probably the better meaning of the term as it is used in the first eight verses of Genesis.

The KJV's translation of the Hebrew raqia as firmament is probably not as justifiable, since the more common usage of that term is expanse, though the word has a number of other possible meanings as well.

Thus, the scriptures could be describing the separation of continents and oceans on the second day--but then it appears that God may repeat the action one day later. Or it could be a division between sky and sea. Or it could be the formation of the heavenly firmament (the stars and solar systems of the Milky Way could be formed at this time), which would have a more cosmic meaning.

The Hebrew could support any of these interpretations.

Well, I'm not sure if I'm a creationist anymore, but I can tell you what I used to believe (No teasing me about this. I was young and credulous =). I, along with many creationists, believed that there was a canopy of vapors in the early atmosphere that sustained a hothouse environment. This was supposed to keep the world at a lovely condition that allowed people to live so much longer than they do now.

Some people even said that the moon at one time crashed into this canopy and it came crashing down, causing the global flood. The "evidence" for this was that ancient star charts suggest the earth's axis of rotation used to be substantially differant than it is now, so there must have been some big impact or something that caused the axis to shift. :rolleyes:

That's just an opinion. Please don't ask me to defend it. 

-jon

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"The simple believeth every word: but the prudent man looketh well to his going." -Proverbs 14:15 KJV

"The unexamined life is not worth living." -Socrates

"If the Medes darken the sun, we shall have our fight in the shade." -Dieneces at Thermopylae

The picture is showing the waters below the firmament, with the firmament, the expanse, space, between those waters below and the waters above the expanse.

If you read my post "Bubbles, Bubbles" it is explained in there. That is a very good picture with which to understand it. And a few other things are interesting like the pyramid over on the side, which I won't get into right now.

But is is accurate in showing water above space. That is what is on the other side. If you were to go to the extents of our dimension, the space, you would find a wall of water.

If anything crashed through the canopy causing it to lose integrity it was probably Hale-Bopp comet. It passed by the earth in 2209 B.C., 105 years before the flood and just about the exact time that Noah had his three sons and began to build the ark. There is evidence in an ice-core record that shows a significant dust event at precisely this time, suggesting that Hale-Bopp split and a portion impacted the earth.
If there was a canopy around the planet, and its immenent destruction was the warning for Noah to build the ark, then the passing of Hale-Bopp was probably the physical agent that caused it.

What do you mean by "the extents of our dimension"? And how do you know that there is water there?

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-Sky-

Moving to Iceland in 2003

Part of my family belongs to the Jehovah Wittinesses.

If the Bible says there is water in heavens then it is. You can't argue against the word of God.

I think what the original writer expressed are

Oceans,
air
clouds

- where air is the firmament that holds the clouds.

Whoever drew the picture reminds me a little on one specific forum goer around this here parts

Artists and science don't go together.

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Time waits for no one ...

I know because a bubble was formed in the water, separating the waters into two separate bodies of water, the water below the expanse and the waters above the expanse. The expanse is space, outer space. So that left the waters surrounding the earth and the waters above the firmament.
The space is expanding to the extents of the dimension that contains it, and the extents are marked by the boundries of the water containing it.
And past that is water as fur as the eye can see.

Duane Morse says:
"I know because a bubble was formed in the water, separating the waters into two separate bodies of water, the water below the expanse and the waters above the expanse. The expanse is space, outer space. So that left the waters surrounding the earth and the waters above the firmament.
The space is expanding to the extents of the dimension that contains it, and the extents are marked by the boundries of the water containing it.
And past that is water as fur as the eye can see."




You mean outside of the universe? There is water outside of the universe?

I always thought that nothing existed outside of the universe.

__________________
-Sky-

Moving to Iceland in 2003

The universe is space, the expanse. It is where matter is formed. It is where the body grows. It is the womb.
Outside of the universe is water, yes.