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Unorthodox Theology A forum to discuss/debate theological doctrines not accepted by mainstream evangelical Christianity (eg. Full Preterism, Unitarianism) Orthodox* and Unorthodox members welcome

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  #41  
Old 15th September 2005, 09:39 AM
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I liked the bit about Paul being the anti-christ!
My money is still on Bush for that role....
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  #42  
Old 15th September 2005, 09:45 AM
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I liked the bit about Paul being the anti-christ!
My money is still on Bush for that role....
I thought it was this guy?

tulc(not sure about Bush, pretty sure Paul isn't!)
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  #43  
Old 15th September 2005, 10:36 AM
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Yet not what Yeshua stated in Matthew, Mark and Luke as these things he said, have been said by Buddha, Lao Tzu and are light and easy to accept.
I was thinking about this thread some more. It becomes clearer and clearer to me that who ever wrote the book of John, whether he was a pharasee in the past or not, whether he was a jew or not, whether he was a very greek jew or not, halaf half, or whatever, he was very anti pharasee.

Here is my logic: what did Yeshua accuse the pharasees of? Making up many little rules that you have to follow or else you will be in the wrong, making up rediculous rules that don't searve a thing, showing off how religeous they were (fasts, tithes, praying out load), shining the outside very well with multitudes of "exterior" comand fullfilling.

"John" is saying: this exterior stuff isn't enough. There is something deeper and more important: spiritual awakening. Being "pluged into the vine" which is Yeshua. Bearing good fruit. Good fruit that means love. It's something beyond the exterior acts, it's the inner motivation that is changed by God and that produces exterior acts that are much more true, because they aren't hypocritical, they have to do with inner change.

That is the big difference with the other religions. That is why christianity is for the sick and the weak who aren't able to be good and do good on their own. It's for those who need help changing. It's for the love thirsty. "John" understood this. (Those of you christian who are storng are free to dissagree)

I may be wrong but this disscussion on the first three gospels verses the fourth reminds me of psychologist Scott Peck's books: In "the road less traveled" he hints that spiritual growth and learning how to love are the point of this life. He advises to do so through dicipline, delayed gratification, and balancing. He leaves the choice to you. In his second book, I think it is titled "more on the road less traveled" he doesn't do any more hinting, he doesn't give any more advice. He tells you that there is simply no other way.
This reminds me of the first three gospels. Yeshua is hinting, being soft. Then in the last book, you see the other facet: there is no other way.

It is normal that there be a difference between christianity and other religions. If all truth were already revealed clearly in other religions, Yeshua wouldn't need to come. I say this as a person who believes that God does find a way to manifest himself through other religions. Other religions may understand a facet we don't.
  #44  
Old 15th September 2005, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Multi-Elis
I was thinking about this thread some more. It becomes clearer and clearer to me that who ever wrote the book of John, whether he was a pharasee in the past or not, whether he was a jew or not, whether he was a very greek jew or not, halaf half, or whatever, he was very anti pharasee.

Here is my logic: what did Yeshua accuse the pharasees of? Making up many little rules that you have to follow or else you will be in the wrong, making up rediculous rules that don't searve a thing, showing off how religeous they were (fasts, tithes, praying out load), shining the outside very well with multitudes of "exterior" comand fullfilling.

"John" is saying: this exterior stuff isn't enough. There is something deeper and more important: spiritual awakening. Being "pluged into the vine" which is Yeshua. Bearing good fruit. Good fruit that means love. It's something beyond the exterior acts, it's the inner motivation that is changed by God and that produces exterior acts that are much more true, because they aren't hypocritical, they have to do with inner change.

That is the big difference with the other religions. That is why christianity is for the sick and the weak who aren't able to be good and do good on their own. It's for those who need help changing. It's for the love thirsty. "John" understood this. (Those of you christian who are storng are free to dissagree)

I may be wrong but this disscussion on the first three gospels verses the fourth reminds me of psychologist Scott Peck's books: In "the road less traveled" he hints that spiritual growth and learning how to love are the point of this life. He advises to do so through dicipline, delayed gratification, and balancing. He leaves the choice to you. In his second book, I think it is titled "more on the road less traveled" he doesn't do any more hinting, he doesn't give any more advice. He tells you that there is simply no other way.
This reminds me of the first three gospels. Yeshua is hinting, being soft. Then in the last book, you see the other facet: there is no other way.

It is normal that there be a difference between christianity and other religions. If all truth were already revealed clearly in other religions, Yeshua wouldn't need to come. I say this as a person who believes that God does find a way to manifest himself through other religions. Other religions may understand a facet we don't.
great post! couldn't give you reps, so i'll rep you here, just no points add, hehe
  #45  
Old 15th September 2005, 11:50 AM
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FLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond reputeFLANDIDLYANDERS has a reputation beyond repute
Originally Posted by tattedsaint
great post! couldn't give you reps, so i'll rep you here, just no points add, hehe
agree-diddly-eeeed
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  #46  
Old 15th September 2005, 06:07 PM
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Why was he Anti-Pharisee?

With scriptures?

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  #47  
Old 15th September 2005, 06:51 PM
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tulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond reputetulc has a reputation beyond repute
Hey just in case you missed these I thought I'd repost them!
Do you have any knowledge of the Jewish sects in the first century CE?
Do you know that the Pharisees believed in the Oral and Written Torah?
Do you know that the Pharisees believed in the resurrection of the dead?
Did you know that the President of the Sanhedrin was a Pharisee?
Did you know that the High Priest was a Saduccee who was given his post from Caesar?
(emph. added)
tulc(just in case you missed them)
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  #48  
Old 15th September 2005, 07:34 PM
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I am absolutly stunned that this thread has lated as long as it has, and that obvioulsy smart people have been trying to get our friend wiz to actually look into the history and facts,

it doesn't appear that it will work, but congrats all of you on an act of love.

Now for some liner notes:
Paul was not the anti-christ, for one thing he was too early. His theology had some flaws, but that happens to the best of us.

Jesus is probably not the Jewish messiah, as our friend points out he does not appear to have met the requirements for the job.

Jesus IS the living God, the font of a new covenant with all the nations. For God so loved the world he sent his only begotton son...., as job descriptions go probably a step up from the messiah for a single, exhaulted, race of people.

Love God, love your neighbor and keep the commandments and all will be well.
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  #49  
Old 16th September 2005, 02:06 AM
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  #50  
Old 16th September 2005, 02:43 AM
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Question

LoL
(tulc) Yes I did and why I say the book of John, was to put the Jewish people off Christ.
As it has done~!
Oh wait you don't think he is Christ???

Can anyone actually post scripture why not, without using anything by Paul and John?
Also unless you are saying that all of John is made up, how could he have known the private Jewish high council meetings?

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