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Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum The Endtimes & Prophecy Forum for the discussion of future events. No full preterist views. Partial preterists welcomed.

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  #1  
Unread 21st July 2005, 02:50 AM
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only he who now letteth [will let], until he be taken out of the way.

2Th 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth [will let], until he be taken out of the way.


People say this is speaking of the Holy Spirit.

How can it be? Will the Holy Spirit ever leave?

Jhn 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
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Unread 21st July 2005, 07:14 AM
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It seems many people have theories about who the restrainer is in 2 thess 2. They usually say it is the Holy Spirit or it is the Church. But what does Scripture say on this topic?

But if we have a question about the Word of God, who are you going to ask, God or man? God says we are to rely on him and not trust in man. If that is true then we should be able to find the answer in Scripture.

In a study I did of the Word on this topic, I found that indeed Scripture does reveal who the restrainer is. Scripture is logical, clear and understandable. To see what I mean read the breif study.

last days mystery (dot) info Restrainer

Richard Perry

last days mystery (dot) info
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Unread 21st July 2005, 08:45 AM
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Hi Forum,

More importantly WHO is being restrained. That is the subject of the first verse you quoted.

As far as who does the restraining, I'm surprised that there ever developed a contraversy over that.

Holy Spirit/will of God/God's force-does it matter?

Justme
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Unread 21st July 2005, 09:00 AM
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Unread 21st July 2005, 11:31 AM
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Hi Hedgehog,

I too have troubles with the pretrib rapture notion that the Holy Spirit is the one who restrains the antichrist. To me, it does not make any sense.

It is clear in Revelation, that there will be those who are saved, followers of Christ, during the great tribulation. If the church is raptured before this time, then that means that they are new converts. It is the Holy Spirit that enters a man's heart and teaches him the truth of Jesus and salvation. How can people come to Christ without the Holy Spirit? I do not believe that it is possible.

Instead, I believe the restrainer is the Archangel Michael. He is the shield of Israel. At a time, he will be removed so that the antichrist can rise to power.

But even if it is not Michael, I still believe that the restrainer is a shield of protection from God, that must be removed before the abomination of desolations rises. I believe that this happened, just prior to 9-11-01. Since that time, I believe that the antichrist has been rising in power, though as of yet, I do not know who he is.

Just my two cents.

John
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Unread 21st July 2005, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Hedgehog
2Th 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth [will let], until he be taken out of the way.


People say this is speaking of the Holy Spirit.

How can it be? Will the Holy Spirit ever leave?

Jhn 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
I am pretrib, and believe the Restrainer is the holy Spirit - but I don't believe He is removed. The Holy Spirit was here prior to the Day of Pentecost, but His role changed to a degree that day in that he now indwells all believers.

And what is being restrained? I beleive it is the appearance of the Antichrist.

2Th 2:7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains {will do so} until he is taken out of the way.

2Th 2:8 Then that lawless one will be revealed whom the Lord will slay with the breath of His mouth and bring to an end by the appearance of His coming;




God predetermined the end from the beginning, and knows when it is time to let the AC appear.

Isa 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, And from ancient times things which have not been done, Saying, 'My purpose will be established, And I will accomplish all My good pleasure';

Isa 46:11 Calling a bird of prey from the east, The man of My purpose from a far country. Truly I have spoken; truly I will bring it to pass. I have planned {it, surely} I will do it.
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Unread 21st July 2005, 08:21 PM
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Hi Free,

So is the antichrist a person?

Justme
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Unread 22nd July 2005, 11:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Hedgehog
2Th 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth [will let], until he be taken out of the way.


People say this is speaking of the Holy Spirit.

How can it be? Will the Holy Spirit ever leave?

Jhn 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
We have been over this a million times, for the millionth and one time ---it is NOT the Holy Spirit. It is Michael, the arcangel, the Great Protector of Israel. Who to this day restrains Satan from destroying Israel.

***********

To those who believe it is the Holy Spirit:

God will not remove what one does not have and Israel does not have the Holy Spirit. That is the entire point of the tribulation by Satan and the seventieth week which is to prevent Israel from her national salvation as God had promised to her.
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Unread 23rd July 2005, 03:59 AM
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Originally Posted by good4u
We have been over this a million times, for the millionth and one time ---it is NOT the Holy Spirit. It is Michael, the arcangel, the Great Protector of Israel. Who to this day restrains Satan from destroying Israel.

***********

To those who believe it is the Holy Spirit:

God will not remove what one does not have and Israel does not have the Holy Spirit. That is the entire point of the tribulation by Satan and the seventieth week which is to prevent Israel from her national salvation as God had promised to her.
well, I don't buy that at all. the entire point of the tribulation (the 70th week) is bring Israel to repentence and to Jesus Christ. It is God that determines the time, it is Jesus who breaks the seal, it is God's angels who sound the trumpets, and God's angels who pour out the vials. And more are reached than just Israel. I don't see Michael as the Restrainer at all - he is no ho katechon. And what is removed is His restraining - not His presence.
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Unread 23rd July 2005, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by FreeinChrist
the entire point of the tribulation (the 70th week) is bring Israel to repentence and to Jesus Christ.
I think a better reason for the tribulation is summed up in this:

Rev. 22:11 "Let the one who does wrong, still do wrong; and the one who is filthy, still be filthy; and let the one who is righteous still practice righteousness; and the one who is holy, still keep himself holy."

The tribulation is the final summation of man's wickedness, and righteousness through faith in Christ. Once it is complete, there will be no room to argue with God on His righteous judgement, because all of the wickedness of sinful man, and Satan's works, will have been complete.

John
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