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9th July 2002, 10:36 AM
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Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | | a "Christian" nation?
I was appaled reading the article "Where should Christians draw the line in trying to make the U.S. a Christian nation?" on this site. In terms of religion, it is not a matter of "trying to make" the United States a Christian nation. The U.S. has always been a Christian nation from the earliest colonial settlements. It remains a Christian nation today. The vast majority of U.S. citizenry claim at least a nominal adherence to Christianity, and, amazingly enough, the majority of our new immigrants make a similar claim -- even those from Asian countries. The U.S. was founded upon Christian principles and beliefs.
How can you say this? Yes, the majority may be Christian, but FOUNDED on Christianity? I think not. Washington, Jefferson, and Adams, just to name a few, were Deists. Franklin was an athiest. In America, this "line" has shifted over the years. In other words, as the definition of a "religious establishment" has changed, the concept of America as a Christian nation has also changed.
Yes, the concept has changed. Now it exists. America wasen't meant to be a Christian nation. In America, it has become politically incorrect to refer to the U.S. in religious terms according to the religion of the majority.
Was it ever not? Such was not always the case. Historically, throughout the world, America has always been considered a Christian nation. Why? Because Christianity was the dominant religion of the land. Christianity shaped the thinking of America's forefathers and informed the making of public policy and law. Christianity was a part of the common law; it was woven throughout the fabric of American life.
As I already said, the majority of the founding fathers were Deists.  Look, nobody is trying to take away your religion. You are free to practice it as you wish. But you CAN NOT impose it upon others, and you CAN NOT force it into a mandatory pledge.
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There is a theory that states that if ever anyone were to find out exactly what the universe is for, and why it exists, it would immediatly dissapear and be replaced by something even more bizzare and confusing.
There is another theory that states that this has already happened.
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I think the surest sign that there is intelligent life in the universe is that it hasen't tried to contact us.
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9th July 2002, 10:55 AM
| | Senior Member
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Reps: 17 (power: 0) | | | Who said the pledge was mandatory? I was under the impression that it was an optional thing.
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"Where there is a will to condemn, there is evidence." |
9th July 2002, 11:31 AM
| | Regular Member
| | Join Date: 28th January 2002
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Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | Who said the pledge was mandatory? I was under the impression that it was an optional thing.
In some places(ergo:where I went) it is mandatory.
__________________
There is a theory that states that if ever anyone were to find out exactly what the universe is for, and why it exists, it would immediatly dissapear and be replaced by something even more bizzare and confusing.
There is another theory that states that this has already happened.
-Douglas Adams
I think the surest sign that there is intelligent life in the universe is that it hasen't tried to contact us.
-Bill Watterson |
9th July 2002, 01:31 PM
|  | god told me he doesnt exist
28
| | Join Date: 4th July 2002 Location: Montana
Posts: 222
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Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | Originally posted by strathyboy
Who said the pledge was mandatory? I was under the impression that it was an optional thing.
Doesnt matter. The fact that it is the teacher, the authority in such a setting, leading the pledge makes it unconstitutional. Besides, you did NOT want to be the poor kid who sat it out or just didnt say anything when it got to "under god"... good way to be an outcast.
PS -
GREAT post, btw, I could hug you for making those points.
I love the new design. I have a question though. Whats with the blessings? I have 7 of them and I dont know where, how, or why I got them. Much less what Im supposed to do with them. I don't intend to purchase any of god's armor.
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"With very few exceptions, the religion which a man accepts is that of the community in which he lives, which makes it obvious that the influence of environment is what has led him to accept the religion in question." -Bertrand Russell
"I don't know that Atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God." -- George Bush
Last edited by Raging Atheist; 9th July 2002 at 01:33 PM.
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9th July 2002, 01:48 PM
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| | Join Date: 13th June 2002 Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
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Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | Originally posted by Raging Atheist
Doesnt matter. The fact that it is the teacher, the authority in such a setting, leading the pledge makes it unconstitutional. Besides, you did NOT want to be the poor kid who sat it out or just didnt say anything when it got to "under god"... good way to be an outcast.
PS -
GREAT post, btw, I could hug you for making those points.
I love the new design. I have a question though. Whats with the blessings? I have 7 of them and I dont know where, how, or why I got them. Much less what Im supposed to do with them. I don't intend to purchase any of god's armor.
Did you start a thread? You get 7 for starting a thread. And people can just give them to you. If you don't want yours you can give them to me. Just click my "bless" button at the top of my post and enter the number 7. Glad I could help you out.  |
9th July 2002, 01:55 PM
| | god told me he doesnt exist
28
| | Join Date: 4th July 2002 Location: Montana
Posts: 222
Blessings: 91,285
Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | | aaah... yes, I started a thread... that would be why... thank you for clearing that up... you already have 600... you dont need any... I'll give 'em to someone deserving... hm... who do I know that needs the armor of god?
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"With very few exceptions, the religion which a man accepts is that of the community in which he lives, which makes it obvious that the influence of environment is what has led him to accept the religion in question." -Bertrand Russell
"I don't know that Atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God." -- George Bush |
9th July 2002, 02:49 PM
| | Regular Member
| | Join Date: 28th January 2002
Posts: 110
Blessings: 90,966
Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | | Oh, and I feel like I missed something there. The Church is trying to gain political influence while not paying taxes. Isn't something wrong there?
__________________
There is a theory that states that if ever anyone were to find out exactly what the universe is for, and why it exists, it would immediatly dissapear and be replaced by something even more bizzare and confusing.
There is another theory that states that this has already happened.
-Douglas Adams
I think the surest sign that there is intelligent life in the universe is that it hasen't tried to contact us.
-Bill Watterson |
9th July 2002, 03:03 PM
| | god told me he doesnt exist
28
| | Join Date: 4th July 2002 Location: Montana
Posts: 222
Blessings: 91,285
Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | Originally posted by Not_a_fundie
Isn't something wrong there?
Yes.
__________________
"With very few exceptions, the religion which a man accepts is that of the community in which he lives, which makes it obvious that the influence of environment is what has led him to accept the religion in question." -Bertrand Russell
"I don't know that Atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God." -- George Bush |
9th July 2002, 04:38 PM
|  | Football Fan
41   
| | Join Date: 14th June 2002 Location: Texas
Posts: 3,454
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Reps: 11,442 (power: 24) | | | "I don't know that Atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God." -- George Bush
Hey Raging, did Bush SR. or JR. say that????
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9th July 2002, 04:42 PM
| | Regular Member
| | Join Date: 28th January 2002
Posts: 110
Blessings: 90,966
Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | Hey Raging, did Bush SR. or JR. say that????
I happen to know, it's a Sr. quote.
__________________
There is a theory that states that if ever anyone were to find out exactly what the universe is for, and why it exists, it would immediatly dissapear and be replaced by something even more bizzare and confusing.
There is another theory that states that this has already happened.
-Douglas Adams
I think the surest sign that there is intelligent life in the universe is that it hasen't tried to contact us.
-Bill Watterson | | |
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