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29th May 2002, 04:53 PM
| | THANK YOU JESUS!!
60     
| | Join Date: 17th April 2002
Posts: 7,538
Blessings: 190,189
Reps: 9,359,418,022,732,134 (power: 9,359,418,022,749) | | Originally posted by parousia70
If I may.......
No, of course futurists are saved.
What we are asserting is that if futurism is correct, then Christians only have the "earnest" of salvation, and not the thing itself.
Thankfully, futurism is not correct, and ALL Christians have actual, finalized salvation today.
How do you answer the preterist view that futurism makes Christ a false prophet? We don't believe Christ returned in 70AD, therefore, according to preterism, futurist can't be saved, as our denial of his prediction that He would return during that generation, surely we are saying Christ was a false prophet since we refuse to believe He returned in 70AD. |
29th May 2002, 05:05 PM
|  | Senior Veteran
39
| | Join Date: 28th December 2001 Location: California
Posts: 4,320
Blessings: 91,522
Reps: 293 (power: 0) | | | I can't and I won't speak for all futurists, but to me the Bible clearly states that salvation was secured at the cross and that my personal salvation was secured the moment I believed and trusted Christ for my salvation. "Finalized" salvation has nothing to do with when Jesus comes again. I am sealed until the day of redemption, period.
__________________ I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, [which is] your reasonable service. And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what [is] that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. (Romans 12:1-2) Faith in Christ is not belief without proof, it is trust without reservation.
I have found no greater joy, than to live totally surrendered to Jesus Christ. |
29th May 2002, 05:08 PM
|  | Christian
| | Join Date: 21st May 2002 Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 420
Blessings: 91,001
Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | Originally posted by Mandy
I can't and I won't speak for all futurists, but to me the Bible clearly states that salvation was secured at the cross and that my personal salvation was secured the moment I believed and trusted Christ for my salvation. "Finalized" salvation has nothing to do with when Jesus comes again. I am sealed until the day of redemption, period.
Then why does Christ have to come back?
__________________
But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised. But he who is spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no one. 1 Co 2:14-15 |
29th May 2002, 05:09 PM
|  | Trying to stay on the narrow road
| | Join Date: 1st May 2002
Posts: 58
Blessings: 90,960
Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | Originally posted by Pericles
Then why does Christ have to come back?
To claim what is His
__________________
<>< |
29th May 2002, 05:10 PM
|  | Living in HIS kingdom...
37   
| | Join Date: 22nd May 2002
Posts: 976
Blessings: 62,407 My Mood 
Reps: 1,951 (power: 11) | | | All Christians are saved, whether Futurists or Preterists. Why? because Christ died for our sins on the cross and was raised the 3rd day.
I am asserting that the New Covenant from God - which is based upon Salvation - was not complete until Christ's 2nd coming in 70AD.
Auntie, you have a knack for twisting words and generalizing.
Read Revelation again.
Do you believe you are saved by Salvation alone, and not by works? Then why at the judgement (as stated in Revelation) are those in Hades judged based upon their works?
If you believe the 2nd coming has yet to occur, and man has yet to be judged, then you must believe that you go to Hades when you die. There you will wait until the time of judgement to find out whether your name is written in the book of Life.....where you are judged based upon your works.
Thankfully, the judgement already occured in 70AD and we will go straight to God's presence when we die.
-A |
29th May 2002, 05:17 PM
|  | New Jerusalem Citizen
45  
 | | Join Date: 25th February 2002 Location: Oregon
Posts: 2,810
Blessings: 1,169,126
Reps: 47,436,886,648,693 (power: 47,436,886,660) | | Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um
How do you answer the preterist view that futurism makes Christ a false prophet? We don't believe Christ returned in 70AD, therefore, according to preterism, futurist can't be saved, as our denial of his prediction that He would return during that generation, surely we are saying Christ was a false prophet since we refuse to believe He returned in 70AD.
Futurism dosen't "make" Christ a false prophet, for Chirst is the TRUE prophet, and no partucular "eschatology" can alter that fact no matter how many people believe in it.
Ones Eschatology does not effect ones salvation status.
Adhering to the "correct" eschaton has never been, is not now, nor ever shall be "criteria" for salvation. |
29th May 2002, 05:20 PM
| | New Jerusalem Citizen
45
| | Join Date: 25th February 2002 Location: Oregon
Posts: 2,810
Blessings: 1,169,126
Reps: 47,436,886,648,693 (power: 47,436,886,660) | | Originally posted by Mandy
"Finalized" salvation has nothing to do with when Jesus comes again. I am sealed until the day of redemption, period.
So, are you saying you are already redeemed?
Even though the day of redemption has not yet arrived? |
29th May 2002, 05:20 PM
| | Christian
| | Join Date: 21st May 2002 Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 420
Blessings: 91,001
Reps: 10 (power: 0) | | Originally posted by stnkyminky
To claim what is His
How does Christ's claim change the FACT that everything belongs to him already? Today you don't belong to Christ? The world doesn't belong to God and Christ? How much more will the world belong to Christ if he appeared in a body in Jerusalem?
__________________
But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised. But he who is spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no one. 1 Co 2:14-15 |
29th May 2002, 05:23 PM
| | Senior Veteran
39
| | Join Date: 28th December 2001 Location: California
Posts: 4,320
Blessings: 91,522
Reps: 293 (power: 0) | | | Those people in Hades will be judged by their works because they were not redeemed by the blood of Jesus Christ. What else would God have to judge them by? When I was saved, Jesus' righteousness was imputed to me, I was justified in God's sight. The unsaved have to answer for themselves. The only people in Hades are the unsaved. True Christians go to be with the Lord.
__________________ I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, [which is] your reasonable service. And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what [is] that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. (Romans 12:1-2) Faith in Christ is not belief without proof, it is trust without reservation.
I have found no greater joy, than to live totally surrendered to Jesus Christ. |
29th May 2002, 05:28 PM
| | New Jerusalem Citizen
45
| | Join Date: 25th February 2002 Location: Oregon
Posts: 2,810
Blessings: 1,169,126
Reps: 47,436,886,648,693 (power: 47,436,886,660) | | Originally posted by Mandy
. The only people in Hades are the unsaved. True Christians go to be with the Lord.
In the OT, all the dead, Saint and unbeliever alike went to Hades, now, if you are asserting that today only the unsaved are in hades, then you are asserting that the OT Saints have been resurrected out of Hades, and are now in Gods presence.
When exactly do you believe this happened? | | |
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