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I don't think this is true. I have known a number of non-religious individuals that believe in ghosts. Ironically, the lack of an organized religion seems to make people more likely to believe in astrology from my personal experience.

Because you're sitting at the computer, indoors.

I feel like I'm missing something here. The EWG (Environmental Working Group) has a list of cities and data on water contaminants, but in the search it seems like the cities link to the utilities of other cities that aren't connected. For example in Michigan, West Branch gives links for Summit...

Well, assuming suffering and death are necessary for a kind of "free will", and the world wasn't developed under direct, or deterministic control, it's not surprising that suffering and death would work their way into the outcome. The Christian idea of remaking the world has always been a bit...

Yeah, of course. I've been wrong about things before.

The way I read that was that you wouldn't give the rebuttal in question a hearing. Apologies if I've misunderstood you twice now.

I hope not. I'd rather win or lose an evidential debate.

Oh shoot, you're right. :doh: I misread that and thought Estrid meant examples of many mistakes and/or greed, base motives, etc. Anyway, to respond to the correct idea, I think we cannot see, or at least cannot clearly see the mistakes we're making right now because we're caught in the...

In other words, it was an important distinction that existed before the trial, not a semantic trick.

No, it would mean the schematic you're looking for is in my mind, not on paper. In any case, the argument seems like a quibble over semantics. Even if no schematic ever existed for a motor vehicle or space ship, we would still hold that these are designed by an intelligent agency.

You literally said

If someone constructed a new tool, but never wrote down anything about it, made no diagrams, etc. by your rationale, the tool wasn't designed. I find that argument unconvincing.

Yeah, that was the other big argument that is supposed to prove that ID is creationism right? But if Pandas was arguing that creationists couldn't invoke the supernatural before the court decision, what could they do when the word they were using, "creationist", became defined as invocation of...

Plently of examples. Also, alchemy was a precursor to chemistry. I really am not sure why you have such low views of our forebears - without their work, none of our current methods or knowledge would exist. It certainly can. I think we can agree that it doesn't have to. Isn't that last...

If we were to, for the moment, assume good faith, I think their perspective has a logic to it. 1. They want to change the culture in favor of either Christian Theism, or Theism generally. 2. They actually believe that there is testable evidence of Design, and that it therefore could...

The reference to a computer program was meant to be an example. A computer program carries information to perform specific functions which unfold as the program runs. I do not think it is accurate to say that they all secretly know that their theory has no evidence and isn't testable and that...

Gross misdirection happens today, as well as contribution of good information. I don't think we've changed all that much, only become more productive at what we've been doing previously. We still have to sift through a lot of that. I think the DI made their motivations pretty clear in the...

There has been a lot of past discussion on testing ID amongst ID supporters and critics alike, so rearticulating some may be the only requirement on that end. In fact, I think both of those sets of questions you guys posed would be integral to discussion and testing of ID as a scientific...

I'll let you know. I might make a different one first with a different idea that I want to kick around. I'm actually getting a bit excited anticipating what kind of pushback I could get. It's pretty cool you can talk with your children about physics. There wasn't too many other people I...

Oops