Creation, science, and the Nicene creed

TLK Valentine said:

That doesn't change the truth one tiny bit.

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Meh ... he wants to blame this on some denomination way back when and get the focus off of educatees TODAY saying the same thing.

AV1611VET said:

Meh ... he wants to blame this on some denomination way back when and get the focus off of educatees TODAY saying the same thing.

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In other words, you don't like to be reminded that the six-day creation and the global flood stand on no firmer scriptural ground than geocentricity

AV1611VET said:

Meh ... he wants to blame this on some denomination way back when and get the focus off of educatees TODAY saying the same thing.

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Well, that's the problem with a religious education, isn't it?

AV1611VET said:

Why blame that on 'the church'?

Weren't priests and scientists basically one and the same back then?

Of course, not all priests were scientists, but most of them?

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No. Even scientists who happened to be priests were censured for unorthodox ideas. My point was that an overly literal interpretation of certain verses was considered essential to Christianity back then, but it isn't now, and the same can be extended to those who criticize TE.

dad said:

Those who claim Adam came from a birth canal rather than being specifically formed by God have abandoned God's word. They cannot claim their opinion is anything but wasted words and thoughts.

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What are you talking about? Are you mistaking the Bible for the word of God still? Why do you constantly blaspheme against your version of God in that way?

dad said:

Those who claim Adam came from a birth canal rather than being specifically formed by God have abandoned God's word. They cannot claim their opinion is anything but wasted words and thoughts.

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But ... but the Bible also says Eve came from Adam's rib.

Are you saying Eve didn't come from a birth canal either?

How can this be possible!?

dad said:

haha

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I know that it is hard for you to understand the Bible. I will gladly help you where I can.

dad said:

CLAVDIVS said:

I thought evolution was responsible for the diversification of life after Noah's flood. So evolution per se can't be a godless lie, can it?

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If one uses the word only in that context...of change after being created by God, then it is obviously not godless. Howver that is not the usual use of the word by science books, documentaries, news stories, educators and etc etc.If one uses the word only in that context...of change after being created by God, then it is obviously not godless. Howver that is not the usual use of the word by science books, documentaries, news stories, educators and etc etc.

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So dad, what about Christians who believe God created primitive life millions of years ago, which then evolved into the life forms we see today. Are they believers in godless evolution?

dad said:

Genesis shows that evolution is a lie.

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But while the Nicene creed says lots about God as creator, it says nothing about Genesis or the Bible.

dad said:

For God to have created all things means a creator. Pretty basic stuff, that. Example, Adam was created, and not born.

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Did God create you?

durangodawood said:

But while the Nicene creed says lots about God as creator, it says nothing about Genesis or the Bible.

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Good point... the creed requires only belief in itself... while it does draw its facts from the Bible, it does not require its adherents to believe it in its entirety.

dad said:

First Council of Nicea (325) First Council of Constantinople (381)
We believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of all things visible and invisible. We believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, begotten of the Father [the only-begotten; that is, of the essence of the Father, God of God,] Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father; And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds (æons), Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father;
By whom all things were made [both in heaven and on earth]; by whom all things were made;




To sign up as a Christian on some forums, as I seem to remember I may have done once on this one...people are supposed to agree with this.

Now my question is to Christians and mods who are Christians and mods in training, etc. How can you preach evolution here and claim you are following this little creed?

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The Nicene Creed was and is the most concise summation of Christian conviction, all Protestant, Catholic and Orthodox believers have affirmed those tenants with one voice throughout church history. There is a reason the Nicene Creed starts off with a confession of God as Creator, it's foundational to all theistic reasoning. Not only Genesis one emphasises this foundational principle but John 1, Romans 1, Hebrews 1 put absolute certainty that God is the Creator of all things, especially life. You can believe in God and evolution as natural history, you'd be wrong but you could still maintain Christian conviction. What you don't get is exclusively naturalistic causes a going all the way back to and including the Big Bang. A God who creates by exclusively naturalistic cause isnt the God of the Nicene fathers, the Scriptures or the Christian faith. Such a God would be the God of Spinoza, Paul Tillich and other pantheists.

Christian Forums does, or at least did, use the Nicene Creed as a general guide for defining what a Christian profession is.

dad said:

If they sign up to a forum claiming they agree, it sure does.

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I read the Nicene creed that you posted twice, just to be sure.

Didnt see anything about the Bible in the list of beliefs it requires.