Does God Try His Very Best to Save Every Single Person?

jimmyjimmy · May 29, 2016

brinny said:
If you are seeking scriptural answers, wasn't the question (especially the question in the title) already addressed?

In John 3:16, it is written what God arranged because He sooo loved the world.

In Jesus dying on the cross, shedding His blood, and with His own Words, Jesus said "it is finished".

What is it Jesus was referring to?

There have been many answers, some have a solid biblical basis, but many don't. It's out there for discussion still, if anyone would like to discuss it. I'm seeking discussion/debate on the matter.

I believe that Jesus was referring to His work on our behalf. He lived the life we should have lived and he died the death we should have died. He took the covenant curse (death) so that we could have the covenant blessings through union with Him.

We are saved by grace alone, but grace is only available to us at Christ’s expense. It's because He perfectly fulfilled the covenant of works that God imputed His righteousness to us.

brinny · May 29, 2016

thatbrian said:
There have been many answers, some have a solid biblical basis, but many don't. It's out there for discussion still, if anyone would like to discuss it. I'm seeking discussion/debate on the matter.

I believe that Jesus was referring to His work on our behalf. He lived the life we should have lived and he died the death we should have died. He took the covenant curse (death) so that we could have the covenant blessings through union with Him.

We are saved by grace alone, but grace is only available to us at Christ’s expense. It's because He perfectly fulfilled the covenant of works that God imputed His righteousness to us.

This is what it means when Jesus said "It is finished"?

Would you clarify if that is what you mean?

I apologize, you've lost me....

jimmyjimmy · May 29, 2016

brinny said:
This is what it means when Jesus said "It is finished"?

Would you clarify if that is what you mean?

I apologize, you've lost me....

He means this:

I believe that Jesus was referring to His work done on our behalf. He lived the life we should have lived, and he died the death we should have died. He took the covenant curse (death) so that we could have the covenant blessings through union with Him. We are saved by grace alone, but that grace is only available to us at Christ’s expense. It's because He perfectly fulfilled the covenant of works that God imputed His righteousness to us.

brinny · May 29, 2016

thatbrian said:
He means this:

I believe that Jesus was referring to His work done on our behalf. He lived the life we should have lived, and he died the death we should have died. He took the covenant curse (death) so that we could have the covenant blessings through union with Him. We are saved by grace alone, but that grace is only available to us at Christ’s expense. It's because He perfectly fulfilled the covenant of works that God imputed His righteousness to us.

"He"? Wasn't i responding to you?

The "finished" is what was needed to be accomplished by His coming to earth and dying, then?

It is the shedding of his blood that conquered death, sin, and the curse?

Is THAT what Jesus is referring to?

Is THAT why Jesus the Christ was sent here?

This then ties into John 3:15. does it not?

To narrow it down, His "work" done on our behalf was to be the Lamb of God, dying for our sin, was it not?

Is THIS what HE is referring to, when He said "It is finished"?

He was sacrificed as the Lamb of God, shedding His Blood for us.

God's whole point in sending His only begotten Son here, was ONE thing.

What was it?

Thanks.

brinny · May 29, 2016

Does God Try His Very Best to Save Every Single Person?

The title of this thread kinda' conjures up the picture of God being overwhelmed, ineptly huffing n' puffing to "try" to "keep up" and "do His best" as He frenzies around to do the "impossible" cuz He sorta' messed up/botched it up, and now He needs to "make it right" by "doing His best" to save ev'ry person, cuz what He did from the gitgo, didn't quite "work out"....

That's what came to mind for me after seeing the title of this thread, etc.

Would you care to elaborate and/or clarify?

Thanks.

jimmyjimmy · May 29, 2016

brinny said:
"He"? Wasn't i responding to you?

I was referring to Jesus, not myself.

You asked what Jesus mean when He said, "It is finished". I replied, He meant this:

brinny · May 29, 2016

thatbrian said:
I was referring to Jesus, not myself.

You asked what Jesus mean when He said, "It is finished". I replied, He meant this:

Thanks for the clarification.

Would you kindly respond to the rest of post #164?

Thanks.

jimmyjimmy · May 30, 2016

brinny said:
Thanks for the clarification.

Would you kindly respond to the rest of post #164?

Thanks.

I already have in #163.

St_Worm2 · May 30, 2016

RDKirk said:
Okay, you referenced this, so what do you say it means:

For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.

Hi RD, I think that passage is saying that God has given all of us a basic/intrinsic knowledge of right and wrong, and that our consciences demonstrate that all of us know the difference! So it seems to me that those who are judged and condemned by God (some will not be, :amen:

.. John 5:24; Romans 8:1), will be so (judged and condemned) on the basis of what they know, not on the basis of what they don't know (even if what they know happens to be nothing more than, "the law written in their hearts" by God).

--David

St_Worm2 · May 30, 2016

brinny said:
[Noah] BELIEVED God.

Hi Brinny, I agree, but my question was more along the lines of what was special or different about Noah such that he 'alone', in a world full of people, trusted God at His word? Was Noah smarter than everyone else? Did He know something that no one else did? Did he perhaps have a better fashion sense, or was he simply the best looking pre-flood dude

Something had to be different, right? Why did Noah "get it" when, literally, no one else did* :scratch:

*(This is, of course, a similar question to my earlier one, "why you and not your neighbor"? Why did you and Noah do the right thing, the good thing, the thing God wanted you to do when many others, who had the same knowledge and opportunity that you did, refused to do the same .. or in Noah's case, when no others did? IOW, why YOU and not THEM? What's so special about you two?

brinny · May 30, 2016

thatbrian said:
I already have in #163.

Hmmm....maybe i missed it?

Would you be so kind as to respond to what i posted, point by point, especially the "starred" question near the bottom?

Here it is:

The "finished" is what was needed to be accomplished by His coming to earth and dying, then?

It is the shedding of his blood that conquered death, sin, and the curse?

Is THAT what Jesus is referring to?

Is THAT why Jesus the Christ was sent here?

This then ties into John 3:15. does it not?

To narrow it down, His "work" done on our behalf was to be the Lamb of God, dying for our sin, was it not?

Is THIS what HE is referring to, when He said "It is finished"?

He was sacrificed as the Lamb of God, shedding His Blood for us.

* God's whole point in sending His only begotten Son here, was ONE thing.

* What was it?

Thanks.

brinny · May 30, 2016

St_Worm2 said:
Hi Brinny, I agree, but my question was more along the lines of what was special or different about Noah such that he 'alone', in a world full of people, trusted God at His word? Was Noah smarter than everyone else? Did He know something that no one else did? Did he perhaps have a better fashion sense, or was he simply the best looking pre-flood dude Something had to be different, right? Why did Noah "get it" when, literally, no one else did*

*(This is, of course, a similar question to my earlier one, "why you and not your neighbor"? Why did you and Noah do the right thing, the good thing, the thing God wanted you to do when many others, who had the same knowledge and opportunity that you did, refused to do the same .. or in Noah's case, when no others did? IOW, why YOU and not THEM? What's so special about you two?

Read it again.

He (Noah) BELIEVED Him. (It is also written that Noah "walked" with God.....what does that mean?) In addition what does the Bible say about "mockers"? What were the people doing all around Noah as he built the ark and as he was telling them why for all of that time? Was he "preaching"?

I have a question for you.

Is that important? (To BELIEVE God?)

Did you watch the part of the video i pointed out?

jimmyjimmy · May 30, 2016

brinny said:
Hmmm....maybe i missed it?

Would you be so kind as to respond to what i posted, point by point, especially the "starred" question near the bottom?

Here it is:

The "finished" is what was needed to be accomplished by His coming to earth and dying, then?

It is the shedding of his blood that conquered death, sin, and the curse?

Is THAT what Jesus is referring to?

Is THAT why Jesus the Christ was sent here?

This then ties into John 3:15. does it not?

To narrow it down, His "work" done on our behalf was to be the Lamb of God, dying for our sin, was it not?

Is THIS what HE is referring to, when He said "It is finished"?

He was sacrificed as the Lamb of God, shedding His Blood for us.

* God's whole point in sending His only begotten Son here, was ONE thing.

* What was it?

Thanks.

http://www.christianforums.com/thre...ry-single-person.7939369/page-9#post-69685367

brinny · May 30, 2016

brinny said: ↑
Hmmm....maybe i missed it?

Would you be so kind as to respond to what i posted, point by point, especially the "starred" question near the bottom?

Here it is:

The "finished" is what was needed to be accomplished by His coming to earth and dying, then?

It is the shedding of his blood that conquered death, sin, and the curse?

Is THAT what Jesus is referring to?

Is THAT why Jesus the Christ was sent here?

This then ties into John 3:15. does it not?

To narrow it down, His "work" done on our behalf was to be the Lamb of God, dying for our sin, was it not?

Is THIS what HE is referring to, when He said "It is finished"?

He was sacrificed as the Lamb of God, shedding His Blood for us.

* God's whole point in sending His only begotten Son here, was ONE thing.

* What was it?

Thanks.

thatbrian said:
http://www.christianforums.com/thre...ry-single-person.7939369/page-9#post-69685367

Can you point out in your response that you linked to where you specifically answered the starred question(s)?

I'm referring to these:

* God's whole point in sending His only begotten Son here, was ONE thing.

* What was it?

Where are they answered in your response?

Thanks.

jimmyjimmy · May 30, 2016

brinny said:
brinny said: ↑
Hmmm....maybe i missed it?

Would you be so kind as to respond to what i posted, point by point, especially the "starred" question near the bottom?

Here it is:

The "finished" is what was needed to be accomplished by His coming to earth and dying, then?

It is the shedding of his blood that conquered death, sin, and the curse?

Is THAT what Jesus is referring to?

Is THAT why Jesus the Christ was sent here?

This then ties into John 3:15. does it not?

To narrow it down, His "work" done on our behalf was to be the Lamb of God, dying for our sin, was it not?

Is THIS what HE is referring to, when He said "It is finished"?

He was sacrificed as the Lamb of God, shedding His Blood for us.

* God's whole point in sending His only begotten Son here, was ONE thing.

* What was it?

Thanks.

Can you point out in your response that you linked to where you specifically answered the starred question(s)?

I'm referring to these:

* God's whole point in sending His only begotten Son here, was ONE thing.

* What was it?

Where are they answered in your response?

Thanks.

We need to address the questions of the OP to keep from derailing this further. Do you have an answer to those questions?

brinny · May 30, 2016

Does God Try His Very Best to Save Every Single Person?

thatbrian said:
We need to address the questions of the OP to keep from derailing this further. Do you have an answer to those questions?

Everything i have posted in this thread is directly referring to, and is responding to the OP questions.

Would you care to respond to the two starred questions i asked you above?

It is directly related to salvation, of which you speak of.

There are other posts in this thread that respond to the OP as well that have not been responded to.

In addition, any confusion garnered in the title of this thread about God appearing to be weak, inept, and discombobulated perhaps needs to be clarified as well. (see post #165)

Thank you kindly.

Rick Otto · May 30, 2016

alexandriaisburning said:
But is this "condemnation" irrevocable? That is the question at hand, I think.

Irrevocable for an arguable amount of time, I think. It goes to arguing over the definition of eon or some word(s) like that.
The other side of this "coin" would then be "is salvation revocable", and most Christians believe it is at least while they still are physically alive. (I don't)

jimmyjimmy · May 30, 2016

I'm afraid that you've missed the gist of the thread, and the title may be to blame, so just consider the two questions and forget the title for now. Christ's death on the cross was complete, yes. I'm after what has God been doing since, if anything, then in regard to salvation of souls.

As far as the title, I've clarified when you asked the same question before:

The questions in the OP are not about God's inability. He is omnipotent. Also, they are not about injustice. God is just in all He does. I'm trying to find out how people on CF answer these questions, and more important than opinion is scriptural backing for their answer(s). Any answer has to be biblically sound, which I'm sure we both agree on.

Is God actively trying to save every man, woman and child?
Is His effort completely equal in each case?

brinny · May 30, 2016

thatbrian said:
I'm afraid that you've missed the gist of the thread, and the title may be to blame, so just consider the two questions and forget the title for now. Christ's death on the cross was complete, yes. I'm after what has God been doing since, if anything, then in regard to salvation of souls.

As far as the title, I've clarified when you asked the same question before:

The questions in the OP are not about God's inability. He is omnipotent. Also, they are not about injustice. God is just in all He does. I'm trying to find out how people on CF answer these questions, and more important than opinion is scriptural backing for their answer(s). Any answer has to be biblically sound, which I'm sure we both agree on.

Is God actively trying to save every man, woman and child?

Is His effort completely equal in each case?

What more is there to add to, in "addition" to Jesus shedding His blood on the cross?

It wasn't enough?

In addition, and speaking of "winning souls", who does that? (is that what you are referring to?)

You? Me?

Rick Otto · May 30, 2016

thatbrian said:
I'm afraid that you've missed the gist of the thread, and the title may be to blame, so just consider the two questions and forget the title for now. Christ's death on the cross was complete, yes. I'm after what has God been doing since, if anything, then in regard to salvation of souls.

As far as the title, I've clarified when you asked the same question before:

The questions in the OP are not about God's inability. He is omnipotent. Also, they are not about injustice. God is just in all He does. I'm trying to find out how people on CF answer these questions, and more important than opinion is scriptural backing for their answer(s). Any answer has to be biblically sound, which I'm sure we both agree on.

Is God actively trying to save every man, woman and child?

Is His effort completely equal in each case?

1. No. Ephesians 1:4 indicates He chose some, not all, for salvation.
2.Yes. Jesus paid the same price for every sinner God chose to save.

Does God Try His Very Best to Save Every Single Person?

Is God actively trying to save every man, woman and child?

Of course! Everybody knows that!

Of course not. He calls and draws only those He has chosen.

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