I'm so sorry to ask this again, but I'm an orthodox. We are not sure in salvation, it's considered to be a process. We hope for it, but I do not know the meaning of the hope. If I am with God now, and I die right at this moment, where will I go? Can I as an orthodox answer this question?
Hope for salvation
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John Davidson
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Jesus said, "Those who live and believe in me will never taste of death."
If you have faith in Jesus Christ then you have assurance of salvation.
If you have faith in Jesus Christ then you have assurance of salvation.
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Cappadocious
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We are sure of salvation. Jesus Christ is faithful even if we are faithless. This is why we say "make me worthy, though I am unworthy." What you may not be sure of is: Do you want God? Read the Gospel of Matthew Chapter 7.
Hope is when you live as if something will happen that has not happened yet, or as if something that you can't see is really there.
To be with God, entering into his Coming Kingdom.
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NJA
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Jesus also warned that "many" who think they believe in him will be told "depart from me, I never knew you".
He also detailed some significant differences between a believer and someone who believes in a "Jesus" of their own, or someone else's imagination.
Foe example, He said that "believers" would receive the Holy Spirit, and "know the day" (John 7:37-38, 14:20) - see Acts 2:4, 33, 39 for details
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NJA
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Jesus uses the word shall and theer is one gospel, the same new covenant for all, Jew / Gentile (See Acts 10:44-48), then and now.
The natural also bearing witness for when a baby is born it cries as the first sign of life - see Romans 8:15-16, Galatians 4:6.
When a person is born again they receive salvation, they become a new creature, it is a great work of God ... it never goes unnoticed.
The sign signifies the covenant ... a new heart is signified by a new tongue.
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Why have you not taken this question/concern to your pastor? Do you have a spiritual father or spiritual director? You need someone who can disciple you in a much more pastoral manner than just talking on a forum board.
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Bryce Harris
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Listen. Us as believers should have the faith that we will inherit eternal life forever and forever without a doubt, Jesus Christ died on the Cross that who shall ever believe in him shall not perish but have everlasting life. If you are truly saved and washed by the blood of the lamb then you are going to Heaven without having to go through a process. You thinking that you have to go through a process for salvation is saying that what Jesus Christ did at the cross was not enough and we still need to do something to earn salvation. That is not correct but a slap in the face in the eyes of God.
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Nope. Utterly wrong. Our Orthodox friend apparently is not well-versed in the Orthodox faith. Salvation is a process - the process of theosis or becoming like god-like (Christlike). It is the process of our natures being healed from the disease of sin and us changing into the bearers of God's nature to so that we can share in the divine love forever.
It is not a legal decree of forgiveness. That is what you are talking about and that is a Western heresy peculiar to Protestantism and its thousands of offshoots. God does not declare us "not guilty." What He does do is change us. This is why the Early Fathers of the Church referred to the Eucharist as "the medicine of immortality." As we cooperate with Him, we are indeed remade into the likeness of Christ. It is a long process that takes a lifetime and does not end after death. We will always be growing and always coming to know more and more about the Father without ever exhausting the riches of His glory.
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Bryce Harris
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I believe in the process of sanctification which is a process that forms us and makes us more like him, so don't get me wrong, I believe that the Holy Spirit works within our lives to form us and to build us to make us more like him. I'm just saying that there is nothing that we can do to earn his righteousness and salvation except by just having faith in Jesus Christ and what he did at the cross, that's all i'm saying. The reason why i say that is because Christians think that they can get saved by doing works which is unbiblical and they also think that they can get sanctified through works which is unbiblical as well. Not saying that works are bad, but when we rely on that for our salvation and sanctification that's when we get it wrong. We are supposed to let go and push our own selves aside and let the Holy Ghost teach us his ways and not rely on doing good deeds. Once we start to submit to the Holy Ghost then he can began to change our lives and then good works will come along with that, but to rely on works thinking you are gonna earn something for it is not how we ought to think.
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What Christians think that you can earn salvation by your works? May I have an example, please?
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Bryce Harris
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Mother Teresa did nothing but good works all her life thinking that she was earning herself a place with God in Heaven, but on her death bed she didn't even know if she was saved, matter of fact she had doubts about God. This is all over the place in the Church because too many Christians just do man made traditions and works thinking that they are earning something when all they had to do in the first place is just believe. Jesus already did the hard work at the cross. Mormons are bad with this. Some actually think that if they do enough works that they are gonna become little gods after death.
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If you read the writings of Mother Teresa, it appears that she was going through a "dark night of the soul," which happens to those who get very close to go. St. John of the Cross wrote extensively about this phenomenon.
There is no "earning" of salvation, and those who think this are either A.) ignorant of proper teaching B.) misinformed by others (including pastors) or C.) prideful, thinking that they can contribute to salvation.
I would, however, be interested in your take on the following verses which indicate that at the Judgment, Christ gives eternal life to those who have done good works:
John 5: 28-29, Rev. 20: 12-13, Matthew 25: 31-46, and Romans 2: 5-10.
*It is my opinion that salvation and eternal life are not the same thing. I can tell you why from the Bible if you are interested.
As for the issue of "becoming gods," this is a very ancient Christian teaching with which you may not be familiar. I remember that when I was Protestant, I never heard such a thing. But many of the Early Fathers taught this, and it is taken from the Bible where St. Peter says:
2 Peter 1:4
Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
This is the glorious future of those who are Christian, that we share in the divine nature and become like God (but not in any way a partaker of His essence). The Transfiguration of Jesus on Mount Tabor is a foreshadowing of this future for mankind, and it is what mankind was created for - union with God in a communion of love.
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Bryce Harris
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We will receive rewards for good works. That is going to happen at the judgement seat of Christ. But if we depend on that as our salvation and sanctification the good works you do will be in vain. If we allow the Holy Spirit and the will of God to rule in our lives good works will automatically come not because we are trying to earn something but because we are just being Christ like. I think we are agreeing but i think you are misunderstanding what i'm trying to say.
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Bryce Harris
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Bryce Harris
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Yes, we do get rewards at the Judgement seat of Christ for doing good works. But if we depend on woks as the means of salvation or sanctification then our works will be in vain. If we allow the Holy Ghost and the will of God to rule in our lives, works will automatically come not because we are trying to earn something but because we are just being Christ like. I think we are agreeing but you are misunderstanding what i'm trying to say.
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Bryce Harris
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My bad i'm messing up with my replies because i'm new here and i'm getting used to the controls lol.
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But you didn't answer my question.
I gave you four passages which state that Jesus will give eternal life - not rewards - to those who have done good works. I would ask you to look at them, read them carefully, and tell me what you think they are saying.
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Bryce Harris
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Your first verse just speaks of the rapture of the Church, where it says "those who have done good" just means those who have kept the faith and was faithful to the Lord that has nothing to do with specific works. Have you noticed that it didn't say those who have done good works?
second verse speaks of the 2nd coming of the Lord when he will judge the nations of the world. That has nothing to do with our salvation. That's when Christ will judge each nation of how faithful they were to Christ. The sheep nations are the ones who believed God and the goat nations are the ones who didn't.
third verse speaks of God judging sinners and making them pay for every evil deed they did, while God allows those who have been faithful to him to inherit his kingdom.
Non of these speak of doing good deeds in order to make it to Heaven. If that was the case then what about the people who cry out to God on their death bed but have no way of doing good deeds like the thief who died on the cross next to Jesus?
second verse speaks of the 2nd coming of the Lord when he will judge the nations of the world. That has nothing to do with our salvation. That's when Christ will judge each nation of how faithful they were to Christ. The sheep nations are the ones who believed God and the goat nations are the ones who didn't.
third verse speaks of God judging sinners and making them pay for every evil deed they did, while God allows those who have been faithful to him to inherit his kingdom.
Non of these speak of doing good deeds in order to make it to Heaven. If that was the case then what about the people who cry out to God on their death bed but have no way of doing good deeds like the thief who died on the cross next to Jesus?
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