Discussion Can you lose your salvation ? -and all the variance of topic is leads to

Alithis

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frankly, what if Joseph Prince interpretation is wrong ? surely i go to hell, then you are in heaven mourning why de1929 didn't listen to alithis earlier :D.

i have been moving denomination at least 2 to 3 times. Born Presbyterian (full OSAS), then charismatics, then wof. Charismatics/wof usually not OSAS. Now I am wof with Joseph Prince grace teachings.

The better question, will i change teacher ? maybe Holy Spirit leads to another new generation preacher that believes back to semi OSAS, or 20% OSAS ? who knows the future ?

back to your questions in bold above, as of year 2016, my expositions is: professional and family context is very different. I already gave parable in my earlier reply. I think that's what scripture want to convey. Why a lot of cautions and warning ? because only in this earth you can become professional. After dead, there is no more way to expand GOD's kingdom on earth.
well simply stated ..you nee to stop following man and get back to the word of God

i don't know anything about joseph prince i never even brought him up ,im not arguing anything about him.
but i am stating that the word of God promises everything truthfully and so many of those promises are preceded by an "IF" .. if you obey ,if you keep my command (do what i say m) IF you endure to the end ,"IF " ..
yes interesting isn't it ... ;)
 
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de1929

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well simply stated ..you nee to stop following man and get back to the word of God

i don't know anything about joseph prince i never even brought him up ,im not arguing anything about him.
but i am stating that the word of God promises everything truthfully and so many of those promises are preceded by an "IF" .. if you obey ,if you keep my command (do what i say m) IF you endure to the end ,"IF " ..
yes interesting isn't it ... ;)

everybody always rooted / get back to the word of GOD. What are you talking about ? am i talking quran now ?
 
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Alithis

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everybody always rooted / get back to the word of GOD. What are you talking about ? am i talking quran now ?
nope .. you were waffling on about lots of denominations and what "people " say .. sure wasn't scripture any way
 
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de1929

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nope .. you were waffling on about lots of denominations and what "people " say .. sure wasn't scripture any way

that's because i believe those denomination and "people" also read the same bible. When they quote bible verses, i know it's my bible.

I can tell you if they quote quran, worry not on that issues.

it is you that do NOT believe other people can read as good as you. you are the one that keep telling us back to scripture right ?
 
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There is no way you can love God with all your heart soul and all your mind 24/7 year after year and love your neighbour as yourself, especially with all the media we have now days showing our brothers and sisters in need. If for 1 second each day we fail in the above then we have sinned 7 days a week 365 days of the year.

you cant tell me you do because that would make you a liar
 
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de1929

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There is no way you can love God with all your heart soul and all your mind 24/7 year after year and love your neighbour as yourself, especially with all the media we have now days showing our brothers and sisters in need. If for 1 second each day we fail in the above then we have sinned 7 days a week 365 days of the year.

you cant tell me you do because that would make you a liar

correct, our biological body is prone to sin, not designed to love GOD.... at least it's an opportunity to give sacrifice imo, to please GOD, but not to purchase heaven's passport
 
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Gideons300

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There is no way you can love God with all your heart soul and all your mind 24/7 year after year and love your neighbour as yourself, especially with all the media we have now days showing our brothers and sisters in need. If for 1 second each day we fail in the above then we have sinned 7 days a week 365 days of the year.

you cant tell me you do because that would make you a liar
If we look at not sinning as something we must do, you are quite right. But God has promised that He will keep us from falling. He has assured us that our walking in full obedience to Him is HIS work, and that He will cause us to walk in holiness. He has promised to make a way of escape in every temptation so we do not give in to the temptations satan throws at us. He has given us a shield of faith that promises to quench every arrow cast at us.

Why do we see so few walking in this level of grace? It is simply because up till now, so few believe it is even possible, because they see it as OUR work, not His. Faith to be forgiven is there, but faith to be kept from sin is rare indeed. It is this that God is about to do in our midst, and we are about to be amazed.

When God promised in Ezekiel 36 to wash us and forgive us, He also promised to actually cause us to walk obediently, glory to God. He then finishes this amazing,exciting prophetic chapter with

"I shall yet be inquired of by the house of Israel to do it for them."

We are the blessed generation who are waking up to the amazing promises of God, and discovering that the promises of. God are our weapons of war and that we no longer have to walk in less than the full FREE INDEED Jesus promised us. What comes next? Ezekiel 37, of course. We, dry bones that we are, are about to come alive,and be planted on the highway of holiness.

How do we insure we are those who endure to the end, and not those who walk away? We hunger for such a walk. Let us not rest content with excuses why we cannot stop sinning. Let us please our God with our faith that what we cannot do, He will do in us. When our hunger for a holy heart matches our desire to be forgiven, amazing things will begin to unfold before us. It is coming and we are about to have our minds blown........and our hearts set free.

Live bones,live. Our God is able.

Blessings,

Gideon
 
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If we look at not sinning as something we must do, you are quite right. But God has promised that He will keep us from falling. He has assured us that our walking in full obedience to Him is HIS work, and that He will cause us to walk in holiness. He has promised to make a way of escape in every temptation so we do not give in to the temptations satan throws at us. He has given us a shield of faith that promises to quench every arrow cast at us.

Why do we see so few walking in this level of grace? It is simply because up till now, so few believe it is even possible, because they see it as OUR work, not His. Faith to be forgiven is there, but faith to be kept from sin is rare indeed. It is this that God is about to do in our midst, and we are about to be amazed.

When God promised in Ezekiel 36 to wash us and forgive us, He also promised to actually cause us to walk obediently, glory to God. He then finishes this amazing,exciting prophetic chapter with

"I shall yet be inquired of by the house of Israel to do it for them."

We are the blessed generation who are waking up to the amazing promises of God, and discovering that the promises of. God are our weapons of war and that we no longer have to walk in less than the full FREE INDEED Jesus promised us. What comes next? Ezekiel 37, of course. We, dry bones that we are, are about to come alive,and be planted on the highway of holiness.

How do we insure we are those who endure to the end, and not those who walk away? We hunger for such a walk. Let us not rest content with excusea wy we cannot stop sinning. Let us please our God with our faith that what we cannot do, He will do in us. When our hunger for a holy heart matches our desire to be forgiven, amazing things will begin to unfold before us. It is coming and we are about to have our minds blown........and our hearts set free.

Live bones,live. Our God is able.

Blessings,

Gideon
Yes that would be good if he kept pouring out his spirit so that he overpowered all evil for us 24/7 but when i look at the Lords prayer. forgive us our tresspasses as we forgive those who tresspass against us.right above that we are asking for our daily bread so it would seen to me that we need to be forgiven daily because we will continue to sin daily.
 
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turtlejoy

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Yes that would be good if he kept pouring out his spirit so that he overpowered all evil for us 24/7 but when i look at the Lords prayer. forgive us our tresspasses as we forgive those who tresspass against us.right above that we are asking for our daily bread so it would seen to me that we need to be forgiven daily because we will continue to sin daily.
Jesus isn't McDonalds where you just drive up each day and ask for your daily forgiveness. Do you trust that Jesus bore all your sins-past, present, and future? Keep in mind all of your sins were in the future when he was on the cross. When you accepted Jesus as your Lord and Savior you may have realized that when He took the sins of the world upon Himself at the cross, He indeed took all your sins as well.
 
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Jesus said what he said for a reason so maybe we should be asking for forgiveness each day alongside the power to overcome so our sin conscience can be clear. I agree that our sins are forgiven past present and future and I dont believe that a believer can be seperated from God once we have been reunited with him, otherwise it would make us a spiritual yoyo being translated from the kingdom of darkness into the kingdom of light, back and forth, back and forth like a tennis ball, sinning, repenting, sinning, repenting. im sure Gods neck would be gettin sore just watching the game. A fast effortless drive though Jesus seems ok with me where we offload our junk and leave each day free and full of the joy of the Lord.Sounds like good news to me . give me a burger of zeal some chips of strength and a whole lot of joy to wash it down with.
 
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turtlejoy

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Jesus said what he said for a reason so maybe we should be asking for forgiveness each day alongside the power to overcome so our sin conscience can be clear. I agree that our sins are forgiven past present and future and I dont believe that a believer can be seperated from God once we have been reunited with him, otherwise it would make us a spiritual yoyo being translated from the kingdom of darkness into the kingdom of light, back and forth, back and forth like a tennis ball, sinning, repenting, sinning, repenting. im sure Gods neck would be gettin sore just watching the game. A fast effortless drive though Jesus seems ok with me where we offload our junk and leave each day free and full of the joy of the Lord.Sounds like good news to me . give me a burger of zeal some chips of strength and a whole lot of joy to wash it down with.
lol I like that last part part about burger of zeal chips of strength and washing it down with joy. Sounds like a hearty lunch.
I agree, Jesus gave this for a reason, and you're probably aware that if you look closely, Jesus isn't saying pray exactly the following prayer. In the light of the finished work of Jesus, the Lord's prayer reminds us of what God does for people. We know from his word, James chapter 1 that God doesn't set up for temptation into sinning. Why would every day we ask God not to lead us into temptation, when we know that He won't? We're not asking God not to lead us into temptation, we're reminded that He won't, and He'll deliver us from evil. In the light of Jesus this prayer is everything to rejoice about, He forgave us as He gave us the grace to be able to forgive anyone who hurts us.

I'm not saying that anyone who repeats the Lord's prayer word for word is wrong, but if someone is feeling that they need to continually ask God for forgiveness, and is 'hearing' that voice "you know what you did is bad, you better go pray to God to forgive you so he doesn't cast you out of his love" I believe that voice is the enemy taunting the believer, and not Holy Spirit because that's not the ministry of Holy Spirit for believers.
 
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Gideons300

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Yes that would be good if he kept pouring out his spirit so that he overpowered all evil for us 24/7 but when i look at the Lords prayer. forgive us our tresspasses as we forgive those who tresspass against us.right above that we are asking for our daily bread so it would seen to me that we need to be forgiven daily because we will continue to sin daily.
May I ask what it means when we are told that if we walk in the Spirit,we will not fulfill the lusts of e flesh? Is this just a goal, an unavailable state for any this side of heaven? When we are told to cleanse ourselves of all filthiness of the flesh and the spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of the Lord, why would we be exhorted if it were out of our reach?

The sin we need to hone in on is those where we know something is wrong, yet we willingly choose to go our own way, despite God making it clear to us through the conviction of the Spirit that we are to walk differently. Are these simply weaknesses, human flaws, or are they willfully doing our own will as we slap forgiveness on it anyway?

I am convinced by God's promises that He can indeed cause us to walk with a "Yes, Lord" on our lips all day, every day. The core question is......

Do we want that? Does our heart crave it, or do we find ourselves quite satisfied right where we are, at peace with a heart that is not hungering for righteousness at all. Here is the dividing line between the eternally saved and those who may have had the good seed germinate , but who did not endure to the end due to either lack of depth or the life being choked out by the cares of this life.

Faith is about to arise in our hearts that God can and will deliver us from evil, not just its penalty, and moreover, cleanse us from all unrighteousness. Our minds reel. Our hearts faint. It seems impossible. And if it were on our shoulders to walk with our evil desires fully defeated, I could not agree more of its impossibility. But God has promised to transform us, to set us free indeed. With God, even this is possible, but first we must become HUNGRY. When we too cry out "Oh,wretched man that I am" and scan the horizon for our deliverer to do as He promised, we are in for the surprise of our life. God is about to bless us in ways we cannot yet even grasp.

Blessings,

Gideon
 
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May I ask what it means when we are told that if we walk in the Spirit,we will not fulfill the lusts of e flesh? Is this just a goal, an unavailable state for any this side of heaven? When we are told to cleanse ourselves of all filthiness of the flesh and the spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of the Lord, why would we be exhorted if it were out of our reach?

The sin we need to hone in on is those where we know something is wrong, yet we willingly choose to go our own way, despite God making it clear to us through the conviction of the Spirit that we are to walk differently. Are these simply weaknesses, human flaws, or are they willfully doing our own will as we slap forgiveness on it anyway?

I am convinced by God's promises that He can indeed cause us to walk with a "Yes, Lord" on our lips all day, every day. The core question is......

Do we want that? Does our heart crave it, or do we find ourselves quite satisfied right where we are, at peace with a heart that is not hungering for righteousness at all. Here is the dividing line between the eternally saved and those who may have had the good seed germinate , but who did not endure to the end due to either lack of depth or the life being choked out by the cares of this life.

Faith is about to arise in our hearts that God can and will deliver us from evil, not just its penalty, and moreover, cleanse us from all unrighteousness. Our minds reel. Our hearts faint. It seems impossible. And if it were on our shoulders to walk with our evil desires fully defeated, I could not agree more of its impossibility. But God has promised to transform us, to set us free indeed. With God, even this is possible, but first we must become HUNGRY. When we too cry out "Oh,wretched man that I am" and scan the horizon for our deliverer to do as He promised, we are in for the surprise of our life. God is about to bless us in ways we cannot yet even grasp.

Blessings,

Gideon
Walking in the spirit is actually being in the spirit realm in him where he is. It takes about 1 second . In the spirit, back here, in the spirit, back here. So we go there in spirit and as we are there his life force transfers to our soul and flesh to remove the wages of sin. You cant clean yourself, it's a removal by the spirit of God. Ok we go into,him and he goes into us.
 
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Truth be told it's a blast when he enters us, but it's a on the floor experience when we try and enter him. There is grace but then there is power as well.lol o to b under the carpet through the floorboards when the weight of the Lord starts pressing down. Like a ox head pressing down on your belly when you try to breathe
 
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Gideons300

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Walking in the spirit is actually being in the spirit realm in him where he is. It takes about 1 second . In the spirit, back here, in the spirit, back here. So we go there in spirit and as we are there his life force transfers to our soul and flesh to remove the wages of sin. You cant clean yourself, it's a removal by the spirit of God. Ok we go into,him and he goes into us.
But that is not what God tells us. Walking in the Spirit, we are kept from giving into evil, and say no to the devil's temptations to sin. When one has struggled with debilitating sins, gets forgiven and yet struggles still, free indeed is what is needed. Let us remember what Jesus told us. He that commits sin is a servant to sin. What is this "free indeed" Jesus told us of in John 8? Nothing less than being freed from its actual grip, not just unending forgiveness, especially if our hearts are fully intending to yield to it again.

Yes, we are still in fleshly bodies until the Lord comes, but we are told in Romans 8 that as children of God, we are not in the flesh (the fleshly nature) any longer and owe it nothing. Now that is the good news of the gospel. Our old nature is dead, and when we agree with God and reckon it dead by faith, and look to God to deliver us from evil as He promised, not just from the punishment for the evil, we find He indeed is the God who cannot lie and all of His promises are yea and amen. Glory to God, no sin can stand against God in us, causing us to walk obediently to His gentle whispering so.

Blessings,

Gideon
 
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SavedByGrace3

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The capitol letter "S" should not be in Gal.
We should "walk in the spirit" as in our born again spirit.
It is our flesh verses our born again spirit... not the Holy Spirit.
 
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Gideons300

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So if we are there, more than we are here, then he is greater than he that is in the world and yes then we can't fulfill the desires of the flesh. Reality we are weak and don't keep it up
The old covenant was flawed due to the fact that we were weak and flawed. Did the new covenant not fix us so that we could walk pleasing to Him in all things? If he ability of the full blessings of the new covenant still rest on our shoulders Andover not His, and we are the weak link, nothing really has changed in this life. Our testimony is that we are still captives to our flesh, and not delivered at all, just given a reprieve. Is it any wonder why men are not asking us what we possess that they do not.

We need, desperately,a new vision of what it means that the same power that rose Jesus from the dead lives in us, and that He makes us overcomes. When we finally combine the blood of the Lamb with the words of our testimony, we will, to our amazement, see the shackles of our flesh fall away.

Free indeed awaits. Now, do we want it? Want it more than our next breath? If so, buckle your seat belts. Book of Acts Christianity awaits us all.

Blessings,

Gideon
 
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The old covenant was flawed due to the fact that we were weak and flawed. Did the new covenant not fix us so that we could walk pleasing to Him in all things? If he ability of the full blessings of the new covenant still rest on our shoulders Andover not His, and we are the weak link, nothing really has changed in this life. Our testimony is that we are still captives to our flesh, and not delivered at all, just given a reprieve. Is it any wonder why men are not asking us what we possess that they do not.

We need, desperately,a new vision of what it means that the same power that rose Jesus from the dead lives in us, and that He makes us overcomes. When we finally combine the blood of the Lamb with the words of our testimony, we will, to our amazement, see the shackles of our flesh fall away.

Free indeed awaits. Now, do we want it? Want it more than our next breath? If so, buckle your seat belts. Book of Acts Christianity awaits us all.

Blessings,

Gideon
Let's just be real and see what's really going on. Are we 100% free in this body of flesh on this earth and the answer is no. What have we got that the world hasent. We get to spend time with God loving him and he us. How cool is that, and yes there is healing and victories along the way, but we don't get the clean plate now no matter how hard we lick it. We have been given the right to have fellowship with our Almighty Holy God Because our spirit has been made right by the blood of the Lamb. This is the greatest victory we have, as no matter how messed up we are we now can access the amazing Glory of our God. A clean plate no, but a full belly.
 
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