True Woship Leader or something else?

Sep 23, 2014
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I'll get right to the point: Why are young "worship leaders" so cocky, arrogant, and egotistical?

Why does someone only a few years out of the local college's bachelor's program who maybe can strum a guitar confidently and maybe sing decently, think that they know everything about everything and have the cocky, egotistical attitude to go with it? The "my way or the highway" attitude when it comes to the praise and worship team.

It doesn't matter the rest of the worship team has been serving the church in that capacity for years and years, and the musicians in the band have years of experience playing and gigging, the young, new, hotshot know-it-all worship leader thinks he or she knows best and nobody else "has a clue" or knows anything about music, life, the Bible, or anything else. They know it all (just ask them) and can easily provide feedback and counsel for any of life's challenges that may come around. The can and do! They have a "minister" certificate to prove it!

I've met more than my share of these characters who can barely fit their massive egos inside the sactuary.

And when asked to play, it's always straight up "four on the floor" rock beats with rehashed Christian lyrics, as if that's good enough. Never do they ask what the congregation would like to hear or what the band would like to play, it's ALWAYS about THEM and what THEY want to play.

Overheard recently: "Well this is MY band, so ______." Fill in the blanks.

Tell me again why we have hymnals in the pews? Is it to weight down the chairs?

Over the years I've witnessed several elder church members pull senior pastors aside and tell them their newly minted "worship leader" needs to loose the attitude and start ministering instead of showing off. Sadly, it has come down to this. What exactly are they teaching in seminaries nowadays? How to be a cocky arrogant rock star?

I think it should be a required class for every religion student or anyone persuing the ministry to take a class in humbleness and humility.

In other words, leave the EGO at home. It's not welcomed.

My apologies if I've offended anyone, but coming from the trenches as an active member of worhship teams, this trend is more that a bit disturbing....
 
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1watchman

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This would be less of a problem if the scriptural way was followed in the various sects (there would not be any sects --only scriptural assemblies). This idea of worship leaders is more of the sectarian spirit, for God should be the worship leader by the Holy Spirit --note the ministry on worship and devotion at biblecounsel.net to see how God intends for His testimony.
 
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dfreeland311

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While there is no room for cockiness in worship, I will say that sometimes there's more to a situation. Also sounds like you may not be giving anyone the benefit of the doubt.

Friend I know just became senior pastor of a dying church. He's trying to make some changes to bring people back in and he's being opposed by everyone, including the current worship leader. Part of their problem is...frankly, their worship sucks. It's not musically bad but they absolutely don't do anything to lead the people with them or connect them to God. He's been trying to gently push for change, but the worship team has just been cutting him down left and right. He's about one bad argument away from bringing in a totally new worship leader himself. He's aware this may cause some band members to drop, but he's also OK with making the necessary changes to start building the Kingdom.

From my experience, if things *need* to change and they aren't...and somebody comes in to clean up a mess, tenure doesn't mean jack. I've seen it time and time again, people that are set in their ways who would rather die than change. I'm not saying that about anything in your situation specifically, I'm just being an advocate here.

It's also worth mentioning that, like it or not, worship leaders are often the only paid staff person in a band and they are directly responsible for the fruits of their labor. They are hired because a senior pastor has cast a vision of what he or she wants worship to look like and they have entrusted that person that worship leader to help usher in that vision, regardless of who is on board or not.

Note: I am not, nor will I ever be a worship leader. I'm just a bass player.
 
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Sep 23, 2014
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Sad to report, but it is because of this particular worship leader's "know-it-all" attitude and cockiness and "my way or the highway" attitude, mixed with fully believing in his own musical superiority and fully believing nobody else knows anything, many church members in this Arlington, Texas church have left. Young families, middle-aged couples and senior citizens. My wife and I are the most recent. We told a few close friends this past Sunday it would be our last Sunday there.

The church members we did tell fully opened up to us about their own anger and frustrations with this particular worship leader, and the new pastoral staff in general. These complaints range from the children's department not being focused enough and repeating lessons, to repeated lessons in extended sessions, to cancelling the 8:30 am "traditional" worship service without notice 3 times, to the young worship leader and his wife continually being the focus of and demanding attention and an "entitlement" attitude - and ignoring everyone else, to choir members quitting due to frustrations and being treated as if they know nothing and getting the unnecessary but often used "I'M the leader, it's my way or the highway" speech. This coming from someone generally 20 - 25 years younger than the people in the band and choir, which count as members a few doctors and lawyers, tenured teachers, etc. Most of those in the choir have had extensive, prior musical training as has the band.

Sadly, the new senior pastor or anyone on the new staff failed to respond to a call from a church member that one of their teenage children was suicidal and needed urgent short-term care. This was the grandchild of one of the elders/deacons of the church. In other words, no minister called or visited the hospital. This was a documented call that came into the church. Why? Was it not thought serious enough? Or was the young staff busy planning the next "worshiptainment" service?

All this points back to young, inexperienced pastoral staff and worship leaders with enormous egos and wrong attitudes.
 
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May 31, 2013
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ODD, I'm not bangin' on you, bud, but I would've shaken the dust off my feet and been out the door months ago. I like big egos in band leaders only if they've got the cred to back it up AND they don't intrude into an area where I'm an expert and can prove it. I've worked with a few big egos in my decades of secular bass and vocals. Most were great. WLs like Tomlin or Walker-Smith or Baloche or Quilala or Pfortmiller -- I want those people to have giant egos because they know what the heck they're doing. But in the local P&W business, with one exception, I haven't met a WL worth a leaky bag of fertilizer. Lots of bluster, lots of front, lots of in-your-face, but totally hollow and clueless inside. Some seem to take enormous pride in being stupid. The only reason the bluff works is because the vast majority of Christian musicians have no spine whatsoever and are afraid to quit. Or worse, are afraid to nip the problem in the bud by pushing back and pushing back hard during an audition or an agreement signing. So they'll just say Yes Sir and show up for another week of rehearsals, services, and misery. You can waste your life and totally miss your calling by playing nicey-nice.

There's the secondary issue of transitioning a church to a newer worship style (and rock content) to accommodate the tastes of younger people that we're trying to bring to the table. It's a valid way to go, in my opinion. But it's never a painless process, and people always will (and should) leave if they're more comfortable with "legacy" worship. Including the musicians who still prefer that style. But having a total butthead who's ignorant of all things running the transition sure doesn't help. That's a scenario for a mass quit -- as in the entire worship team. (Whoa... did he actually say that? Yes I did.) Sometimes a response this severe is the only way to combat the fatal combination of arrogance and incompetence. May I suggest you employ it, without prior notice. Trust me, it works. And there are other traditional churches who might be happy to put all of you on the bench for rotation duty, separately or en masse.

I may not have understood all the dynamics of this mess, but I think I got most of it.

(Oh, wait, I just re-read your last post. You're already gone. Congratulations. Now look for a place that'll value your skill set.)
 
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DannLeavitt

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Seems like there's a lot of food being thrown around the cafeteria here... ;)

I'm a 20 year old youth pastor who grew up as a pastors kid. I ran from being called into ministry in my high school years, but in my 12th grade decisions, decided to honour God with one year of Bible school. Well, in one more year I will have my diploma from that Bible school after 4 years. It happens!

My issue is that, as a young leader, I see both sides. I am the worship leader at my church, and I was given no training whatsoever. When I first started leading worship, I was likely perceived as cocky and arrogant. But I just didn't know better. Now, 3 years of leading worship later, my ernest prayer each time I step onto the platform is that God would help the congregation ignore me and instead see Him through the worship that we bring. But there were many bumps in the road until I came to where I am now. Seeing the road I've been on also makes me believe there's a long road ahead, too.
But boy, am I thankful for a church who didn't let go of me because I was cocky, egotistical, and unexperienced...

As for the suicidal teen bit, I think that does need to be addressed, but I guess, on both the sides of the pastor and the worship leader, I think these questions genuinely need to be asked of the congregation/board members:
1. Have we given the pastor/worship leader a written job description?
2. Have we informed said staff member that their actions are not lining up with what the church needs from them?
3. Have we offered to be part of the solution to seeing them get to where we need them?
4. Have we warned them of the consequences here on out of their actions?

If you can answer no to any of those, you cannot blame the member fully. You said it yourself, they are unexperienced. They may not know any better. I sure didn't when I started. I needed to surround myself with people who knew my potential and wanted to see me get to a better place. Be one of those people who surround the individual.
 
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Dann, it's good to see someone that young who's obviously got his head screwed on straight. Your list is a good one. However, there are WLs out there who've built such high ego walls around themselves that they're going to do what they want to do, period, regardless of professional-caliber input, regardless of policy/corrective direction from Management, regardless of the ultimate collateral damage. These situations actually do exist. Maybe it's a regional aberration -- I don't know, and I don't really care because it's nothing I can influence. In a sense, you're lucky, since you're a WL, rather than under the authority of one, and so you may never experience what I'm talking about. It's visible only to qualified musicians and singers who "make the rounds" and get a fairly wide sampling of the people who are permitted to run things.

Anyway, good luck with your church, and I would say they're blessed to have someone calling the shots who's young and seems to know what he's doing.
 
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Sep 23, 2014
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Unfortunately, I'm seeing many church members frustrated but hanging on because they have put their time into building up that church and waiting until the new ego leaves. I'm sensing this new worship leader in his mid-20's cannot relate to anyone older than about 30 or 35, which says he is too immature to accept opinion and guidance from anyone older than he. It's a shame but this is a trend I am seeing all over the area. Young worship leaders coming in and not being able to relate to older, more mature members who try to offer advice and guidance in a very constructive way, but are shut down by the "My way or the highway" attitude of the new kids. It's not just me, I've have several musicians make contact with me and tell me their horror stories of having to deal with massive egos and arrogance from kids just out of school or by only several years. It's sad. THIS is the state of things in Praise and Worship music nowadays. There is a trend and it's not a good one.
 
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Job8

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I'll get right to the point: Why are young "worship leaders" so cocky, arrogant, and egotistical?
Probably because they have no business being "worship leaders". The whole concept of "worship leaders" is unscriptural, hence false. So your first order of business is to challenge your church to prove from the New Testament that this is according to New Testament church practice. If not, it should be abandoned.
 
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talitha

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I am a worship leader. I believe it is an important ministry. The Holy Spirit brought me up short when I began to believe that when I REALLY grew into ministry, l would be a preacher. I was lead to study the mentions of music in the Bible, and I found so many.... Apparently, it's pretty important to God! #timetorepent
 
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Music ministry is very important to the church and provides an excellent way to serve the Lord. But what we are seeing, I'm afraid, is the CCM movement (and others) completely taking over the traditional "Minister of Music" role and providing instead an instant "Worship Leader" who may or may not even be a licensed minister, as was most who served in the traditional Minister of Music role. If someone can strum a guitar or sing decently they are immediately promoted to the head of the class and instructed to "lead" worship regardless of past religious education, musical experience, etc. The massive ego I refer to in the posts above I was shocked to learn he still did not have his ministry license from the specific denomination we are members of.
 
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talitha

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Music ministry is very important to the church and provides an excellent way to serve the Lord. But what we are seeing, I'm afraid, is the CCM movement (and others) completely taking over the traditional "Minister of Music" role and providing instead an instant "Worship Leader" who may or may not even be a licensed minister, as was most who served in the traditional Minister of Music role. If someone can strum a guitar or sing decently they are immediately promoted to the head of the class and instructed to "lead" worship regardless of past religious education, musical experience, etc. The massive ego I refer to in the posts above I was shocked to learn he still did not have his ministry license from the specific denomination we are members of.
I have never heard of a worship leader being required to have a ministerial license. I have one, but I have never heard of that requirement. I got mine because I went through a mentorship under my then-pastor and then entered the ministry as a missionary. I don't see ministerial licenses as very important, but I do agree that a level of spiritual maturity needs to be in place before a person is given the platform, particularly on a regular basis.
 
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actionsub

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I have never heard of a worship leader being required to have a ministerial license. I have one, but I have never heard of that requirement. I got mine because I went through a mentorship under my then-pastor and then entered the ministry as a missionary. I don't see ministerial licenses as very important, but I do agree that a level of spiritual maturity needs to be in place before a person is given the platform, particularly on a regular basis.

When I actually GOT my ministerial license, I was young, punky and REALLY immature. It is for the good of the Church that God put me on the backburner for a couple of decades...
Now that I've gotten enough maturity that people actually take me seriously, it seems like I'm being led back to worship leading (when I really was preparing for the pastorate). If God wants me in this spot, I'm happy as a clam.

(To be honest, I'd trade in seminary for the ability and coordination to sing and play an instrument at the same time...)
 
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If you're only using the New Testament, musical instruments would need to eliminated. That's the reason some churches that don't allow them - or that's what I've read. Or is that what you're suggesting?

posted: If God wants me in this spot, I'm happy as a clam.

That's the key. Believers need to be in the position of service that Yahweh wants.
 
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rockytopva

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Woship... If the worship is not correct it is indeed woeful! RW Schambach is preaching a message on the two trumpets of Leviticus...

Make thee two trumpets of silver; of a whole piece shalt thou make them: that thou mayest use them for the calling of the assembly, and for the journeying of the camps. - Numbers 10:2

In which represents...

1. The Spirit - The worship service performed by the worship leader and choir
2. The Word - The preaching service performed by the pastor

We have had troubles in our church that has left attendance down. Right now we are in need of a piano player. If a church has the two trumpets, the worship and the time in the word, and they work together, a church can really do well. Sometimes if the worship is good we can say we had church!

 
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rockytopva

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Could you clarify - "...if the worship is good we can say we had church?"

Are you referring to the singing portion of the service?

The worship in between the opening prayer and the last song. I work at a large factory. One Monday morning the Coke man came by to stock our Coke machines. As he was stocking he was humming a hymn to himself with a joyful look. Without knowing the man I could tell he had a good worship service at his church the day before!
 
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rockytopva

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I agree with you but know that there are believers who think that unless there's a sermon, the service is out or order, unBiblical. To me, the lyrics should contain the message. Just as your example as shown, the impact is there, also.

There are some instances where the sermon was good but the music part wasn't. The two have got to work together.
 
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