Spiritual Israel

DaveW-Ohev said:

Not just him. That group also included Peter and James. And they acknowledged that God Himself was in league with this:

Acts 15.28 “For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay upon you no greater burden than these essentials:

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Not this. I am speaking of Paul claiming as an exclusive apostle of Gentiles and Peter for Jews! His own division of self-proclamation against the directive of Jesus.

I do not see the fact that MOST Jews rejected Him as a "basic aspect" of anything; and certainly not Judaism. In fact, OBEYING the Risen Lord is what Judaism is supposed to be all about. Those Jews who continue to reject Messiah are lessened in their Judaism for it.

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That is the perspective of you now, not of the Jews. Of course, they are looking forward to another Messiah.

DaveW-Ohev said:

A very narrow view of that. Too narrow.

Are we not told to EMULATE Him? WWJD? ? ? ?

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Yes, He experienced the past to usher in a bright future of eternal life for those who follow Him! That means, moving forward, not going backwards!

DaveW-Ohev said:

If you are referring to Matt 5 or Matt 18, then you are dealing with a DIFFERENT situation. Those passages deal with sins between believers and should be handled in private because they do not involve others. In the case of Peter, he wronged people in public by dissing them publicly, and therefore had to be rebuked PUBLICLY.

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Yes, both. Your defense is a 'tit for tat' strategy inapplicable to believers in Christ. I don't see the important trait of humility in Paul's method.

Israel is a people, always has been a people. Stars and Sands.

Much of the OT prophecy has yet to take place, to reject Israel as a people that STILL exist is to reject the OT and God's Word.

Jerusalem is the city where God has planted his name, the State of Israel is still the land of Canaan.

Israel exists in every nation. Those who the Father has called out of Babylon (christianity and judaism) are Israelites.

The two sticks of Ezekiel 37 are not yet one.

Taking place now-
11Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts. 12Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel. 13And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves, 14And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.

This will not happen until the return of the Messiah.......Millennial.
15The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying, 16Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and for all the house of Israel his companions: 17And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand. 18And when the children of thy people shall speak unto thee, saying, Wilt thou not shew us what thou meanest by these? 19Say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they shall be one in mine hand. 20And the sticks whereon thou writest shall be in thine hand before their eyes. 21And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: 22And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all: 23Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God.

24And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them. 25And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever. 26Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. 27My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 28And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.



The Dry Bones.....
See Leviticus 26:27&28
The 7 fold punishment of Israel (2730 years) was lifted around 2008.......Israel has awakened.


Also-
Exodus 31:13
"Say to the Israelites, 'You must observe my Sabbaths. This will be a sign between me and you for the generations to come, so you may know that I am the LORD, who makes you holy.


To accept the concept that Israel no longer exists is to reject the Sign/Seal of God.

Sheeple Shepherd said:

Much of the OT prophecy has yet to take place, to reject Israel as a people that STILL exist is to reject the OT and God's Word.

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Which OT prophesies haven't been fulfilled? If you can provide a list then we can address them....

Sheeple Shepherd said:

See Leviticus 26:27&28
The 7 fold punishment of Israel (2730 years) was lifted around 2008.......Israel has awakened.

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The correct rendering of the "7" times would be 2520 years (360 x 7). There were two scatterings that happened.. the southern tribes and the northern. The start of those scatterings were in 677 bc and 723 bc and ending in 1798 ad and 1844 ad. Two very important dates in prophesy. One is the end of the 2300 day prophesy in Daniel when the sanctuary would be cleansed and the other is the end of persecution of God's people by the Papal power in 1798 and the beginning of the time of the end.

EastCoastRemnant said:

Which OT prophesies haven't been fulfilled? If you can provide a list then we can address them....

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Zech 14

Start there.

EastCoastRemnant said:

The correct rendering of the "7" times would be 2520 years (360 x 7). There were two scatterings that happened.. the southern tribes and the northern. The start of those scatterings were in 677 bc and 723 bc and ending in 1798 ad and 1844 ad. Two very important dates in prophesy. One is the end of the 2300 day prophesy in Daniel when the sanctuary would be cleansed and the other is the end of persecution of God's people by the Papal power in 1798 and the beginning of the time of the end.

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390 years of captivity.
Israel did not repent.
7x punishment.........7x390 is 2730years
From 722bc is 2730-722=2008
Year of 2008.

From BibleLight.net...

One of the most misunderstood and misinterpreted time periods to be found in scripture is the time, times and half a time which is mentioned in Daniel and Revelation:

Dan 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.
Dan 12:7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.
Rev 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

The word time in this context refers to a period of a year. In the story of King Nebuchadnezzar, because of his pride, he went crazy for seven years and ate grass as an ox-
Dan 4:32 And they shall drive thee from men, and thy dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field: they shall make thee to eat grass as oxen, and seven times shall pass over thee, until thou know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will.

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So, "time" represent a year in Bible prophesy, not the time of captivity....

Judah returned to Jerusalem and is numbered, Israel remains scattered and is unnumbered.
Judah is charged with the protection of Torah, still the harlot but not necessarily scattered.
Judah returns to Israel, ONE, is Israel, not separate.

I've never heard of a single rule for a year/day in prophecy.


Here is another-
Genesis 6:3
Then the LORD said, "My Spirit will not contend with humans forever, for they are mortal; their days will be a hundred and twenty years."

This is not the lifespan of a man's life.
Hebrew understanding is-
120 years is a set of years, Jubilee, 120 sets of 50 years.
One Jubilee is 7x7 annual Sabbaths +1 year, the Jubilee year.
120 years x 50 = 6000 years.
The Millennium is 1000 years or the last day, 7th day, day of rest, the return and rule of Messiah.
We are nearing the end of the 6000 year period of man's self rule. We are about to enter in the Rest.

Psalm 90:10
Our days may come to seventy years, or eighty, if our strength endures; yet the best of them are but trouble and sorrow, for they quickly pass, and we fly away.

As you see, 120 years is not the lifespan of man.

DaveW-Ohev said:

No - they are physical Israel. 12,000 from each physical tribe.

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The only physical tribes remaining in the 1st century were Judah, Benjamin and a few Levites. Anna is mentioned as being from Ashur in Luke but as for the northern tribes they were lost to history. The 144,000 are the tribes of spiritual Israel. The book of Revelation was written to the church so the Jewish symbols like the 144K and others apply to the church. It would be physically impossible to have 12,000 pure blood virgin Jews at the end of time seeing they didn't even exist 2000 years ago.