Liberal Messianics

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sickntired771

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I wanted to create a thread for those of us who identify as liberal followers of Yeshua. This isn't to create a divide, we are all one in the body of Messiah but many Messianics do trend conservative politically and I wanted to converse among friends who espouse a more progressive view. God bless!
 

sickntired771

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That's very true but over the years I have found a number of messianics who are more liberal/moderate politically speaking when it comes to economics and social policies. I wonder if it differs by location, U.S. messianics seem to be very conservative but some around the world seem to be a bit different. A lot of the messianic congregations in the U.S. seem to be influenced by the evangelical movement.
 
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Lulav

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I wanted to create a thread for those of us who identify as liberal followers of Yeshua. This isn't to create a divide, we are all one in the body of Messiah but many Messianics do trend conservative politically and I wanted to converse among friends who espouse a more progressive view. God bless!
This isn't a political forum so I'm not sure what you mean by a liberal Messianic, and also you seem to identify as a Non-Denom so not sure why you would start this thread in here, can you help me to understand your views?
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Lulav

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Yup, most of Judaism is fairly liberal, which makes it surprising to me that Messianics went the way of Evangelicalism instead of Judaism.
I would say that most that gravitate to this forum and stay are more conservative or even bordering on orthodox, like conservadox if you will. Those who are more liberal don't usually find discussing Torah an everyday hobby or premo pursuit.
 
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Lulav

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I'm not sure that's valid. Being liberal doesn't mean one doesn't care about the Torah. And the Messianics here seem to go more conservative than Orthodox. Most Orthodox don't even treat gays as badly as people here did in the Poll discussion on opening the topic here.
I didn't say they don't care about Torah, but those who frequent here studying Torah and all aspects of G-d are of premier pursuits.
 
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danny ski

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I'm not sure that's valid. Being liberal doesn't mean one doesn't care about the Torah. And the Messianics here seem to go more conservative than Orthodox. Most Orthodox don't even treat gays as badly as people here did in the Poll discussion on opening the topic here.
The main reason we're generally more liberal is because of what is at the core of our beliefs. Justice and mercy. It is extremely difficult to achieve balance between those two concepts. It is impossible to exercise both without an open mind and open lines of communication. I'm not suggesting that MJs have closed minds, just saying that we have a very, very long tradition of trying to reach the right balance. The constant dialogue almost always produces more tolerant and wider outlook on a subject.
 
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Marius27

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Why devote your time to study and not put into practice what you learn?
Because legalism isn't the point of studying Torah, and how can you be sure what you're studying is correct? Lev 18:22 is clearly referencing pagan idolatry, yet it's used as a weapon. That's a misuse of Torah and poor studying.
 
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Lulav

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Because legalism isn't the point of studying Torah, and how can you be sure what you're studying is correct? Lev 18:22 is clearly referencing pagan idolatry, yet it's used as a weapon. That's a misuse of Torah and poor studying.
We're all entitled to an opinion, and I said nothing about "legalism", I believe most here study Torah to learn how to please G-d, and have the heart of David for it.
 
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BukiRob

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Because legalism isn't the point of studying Torah, and how can you be sure what you're studying is correct? Lev 18:22 is clearly referencing pagan idolatry, yet it's used as a weapon. That's a misuse of Torah and poor studying.

I see no way that you can present a reasoned biblical argument that Lev 18:22 is dealing with pagan idolatry.
 
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Open Heart

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I wanted to create a thread for those of us who identify as liberal followers of Yeshua. This isn't to create a divide, we are all one in the body of Messiah but many Messianics do trend conservative politically and I wanted to converse among friends who espouse a more progressive view. God bless!
Can you clarify for the record what you mean by liberal? Do you mean:
Less observant Torah speaking?
Theologically liberal aka non-creedal?
Politically liberal?
 
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Hoshiyya

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Yup, most of Judaism is fairly liberal, which makes it surprising to me that Messianics went the way of Evangelicalism instead of Judaism.

Well, in Israel it's more conservative, depending on what one means by conservative, of course.

As for the religiously committed Jews who vote liberal / Dem, I don't think they really agree with everything that these things stand for....

It is actually a very universal pattern. A minority group, in the country of another group, will vote for what gives them more freedoms to practice their own laws. But the same minority group, when in their own country (ie when not a minority) often votes more conservative.

By the same token, Muslims vote liberal / Dem in the US, and everywhere else, except in their own countries...


Imams, when asked, will urge people to vote Democrat in the US. However it does not mean they support LGBT issues, for example.
 
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Marius27

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Well, in Israel it's more conservative, depending on what one means by conservative, of course.

As for the religiously committed Jews who vote liberal / Dem, I don't think they really agree with everything that these things stand for....

It is actually a very universal pattern. A minority group, in the country of another group, will vote for what gives them more freedoms to practice their own laws. But the same minority group, when in their own country (ie when not a minority) often votes more conservative.

By the same token, Muslims vote liberal / Dem in the US, and everywhere else, except in their own countries...


Imams, when asked, will urge people to vote Democrat in the US. However it does not mean they support LGBT issues, for example.
Well, at least 70% of Jews support SSM and LGBT rights, so they aren't like Muslims.
 
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Open Heart

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Well, at least 70% of Jews support SSM and LGBT rights, so they aren't like Muslims.
Look at the statistics of just those who attend synagogue every week. They are more likely to be the opposite of the general majority on almost every measure. Especially the Orthodox.
 
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Hoshiyya

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Well, at least 70% of Jews support SSM and LGBT rights, so they aren't like Muslims.

What an absurd statement. You'd have to quote the source of that statistic, and clarify if you're talking about the US or the world in general, and whether secular Jews are counted, Jews who practice Christianity, etc etc.

I cannot imagine that you honestly think that was a convincing or meaningful statement. Nor does such a statistic represent the history and historical religious tradition of Judaism.
 
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