What does Catholicism have to do with Messianic Judaism????

Open Heart · Sep 2, 2015

Righttruth said:
Freedom from meaningless rituals and keeping up with spirit of the Law.

By "meaningless rituals" are you referring to the keeping of shabbat? Because it certainly isn't meaningless to any of us in here!!!!!

You have to actually keep a law in order to keep its spirit.

I have to tell you, you are crossing a line, and it's only a matter of time before someone in the subforum says "enough!" This is a place where those of us come who love to keep the Torah. It is against our subforum rules to argue against lawkeeping. The disparaging manner in which you speak of the Law to us only seems to speak disparagingly about the God who gave it. You might want to consider taking a more respectful tone in here, and save your scorn for the Sabbath and the Law subforum.

Open Heart · Sep 2, 2015

Righttruth said:
Since Jesus Christ is the Lord of the Sabbath too, the spirit behind it should be observed, not traditions or conventions.

You cannot keep the spirit of a law if you break the law.

Righttruth · Sep 2, 2015

visionary said:
The law of God contains no meaningless rituals.

The spirit of keeping the Law spiritually is more difficult and important for pleasing God.

yesyoushould · Sep 2, 2015

Open Heart said:
I post all over CF. I post in the theology section, the ethics section, etc. If I want to talk about Catholic stuff, I don't post about it here. I don't see what it has to do with Messianic Judaism. I will post in OBOB, or in one of the other appropriate forums such as Mariology.

Yet when I come in here, there is always a thread or two going about the Catholic church or the pope (and not usually a nice one). Why? Why HERE?

I don't think it's appropriate to the forum. It's not in the rules, and there's nothing I do about it. But I can have my say, and my say is this: I wish you'd take it to the proper forum and leave it out of MJ.

Catholic and Jewish lives matter. Right?

yesyoushould · Sep 2, 2015

Righttruth said:
The spirit of keeping the Law spiritually is more difficult and important for pleasing God.

God isn't the author of confusion.

yesyoushould · Sep 2, 2015

No matter how much Gods own are refused by the world vis, Gods truth will prevail. :b

pat34lee · Sep 2, 2015

Righttruth said:
The spirit of keeping the Law spiritually is more difficult and important for pleasing God.

If you cannot keep the letter, the chances are ZERO that you keep the spirit. Do you even know the fruits of the spirit? Because you definitely don't show them in your posts. You are an argumentative child, whatever age you are, and need to learn before you attempt to teach others .

Open Heart · Sep 3, 2015

yesyoushould said:
Catholic and Jewish lives matter. Right?

I would think that all lives matter, wouldn't you agree?

visionary · Sep 3, 2015

Righttruth said:
The spirit of keeping the Law spiritually is more difficult and important for pleasing God.

Yes, absolutely but the substance is in the obedience to the law, spiritually you need to understand that.

Shimshon · Sep 3, 2015

visionary said:
Yes, absolutely but the substance is in the obedience to the law, spiritually you need to understand that.

I hope you realize how this is more than likely taken to read that obedience to the law is the substance of salvation. You're going to be seen as stating what matters to God is our obedience to the law. Are you aware how legalistic you just came off? BTW, the correct phrase is 'the substance is Messiah'.

visionary · Sep 3, 2015

Messiah, as our example, reveals the obedience to the law which we are to follow.

Righttruth · Sep 3, 2015

Open Heart said:
You cannot keep the spirit of a law if you break the law.

Agreed. The spirit of the Law takes one beyond that.

Righttruth · Sep 3, 2015

yesyoushould said:
God isn't the author of confusion.

Right.

Righttruth · Sep 3, 2015

pat34lee said:
If you cannot keep the letter, the chances are ZERO that you keep the spirit.

True.

Do you even know the fruits of the spirit?

The fruit of the Spirit is singular with different attributes.

Because you definitely don't show them in your posts. You are an argumentative child, whatever age you are, and need to learn before you attempt to teach others .

I am not trying to teach, rather sharing. Arguments may help in knowing the truth as long as they are dignified and decent.

Righttruth · Sep 3, 2015

visionary said:
Yes, absolutely but the substance is in the obedience to the law, spiritually you need to understand that.

That is what I am trying to pinpoint.

visionary · Sep 3, 2015

Righttruth said:
That is what I am trying to pinpoint.

ok?? .. pinpoint how??

The Lone Ranger · Sep 4, 2015

Foremost, God wants a relationship with HIS creation. How can anyone have a relationship with HIM, if they refuse to obey HIS laws? HE said we have earthly parents, and a Heavenly Father. If you obey your parents, you enter into a positive relationship with them. Likewise, if you disobey them, you enter into a less than positive relationship with them. God is the same way, more or less. HE is a searcher of hearts and souls, and is a jealous GOD.

pat34lee · Sep 4, 2015

Righttruth said:
I am not trying to teach, rather sharing. Arguments may help in knowing the truth as long as they are dignified and decent.

Most of us here started believing as you do. Then we grew by study and learning. Hebrews 5:12
You would do better to ask questions and learn from the people here instead of arguing.

Open Heart · Sep 4, 2015

Righttruth said:
I am not trying to teach, rather sharing. Arguments may help in knowing the truth as long as they are dignified and decent.

My dear, I know you mean well, but you do meet the criteria for teaching. You don't get to argue your contrary ideas in here. You can ask questions if you like. There is another forum, Sabbath and the Law, in the General Theology section, where you are free to debate your ideas. I go there a lot, as does Lulav. I find it fun, and I hope that the dialogue is enlightening to those reading.

Hoshiyya · Sep 4, 2015

visionary said:
Messiah, as our example, reveals the obedience to the law which we are to follow.

Well said.
People are always attaching soteriological concerns to Torah-observance, which really just problematizes what is actually a truly simple matter. Keep the law of God, because God said so. Salvation, damnation, let God decide that; let's just focus on obeying and studying his glorious Word !

Bringing soteriology into the debate is often (but not always) just a front for antinomianism. Those (Christians) who oppose Torah-observance seem to me far more concerned with "salvation" than the Torah-observant (Jews).
This is likely because they don't have the Torah, so obsession over a mystical and undefined concept of salvation takes the place of study/application of Biblical mitzvot.

What does Catholicism have to do with Messianic Judaism????

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