Scripture does not explicitly state this in a concrete word but it is implied and commonly accepted.
Hello my friend and thank you for replying.
I have likewise believed that God's eternal nature was implied by Scripture, but I've yet to find anything that states this. I cannot find any Scriptures that say God exists in all time, or that God is outside of time. I usually find that when an unscriptural term is used, it requires many more unscriptural terms to explain it's relevance.
Here is what Augustine says about God and eternity:
"In the eminence of thy ever-present eternity, thou precedest all times past, and extendest beyond all future times, for they are still to come — and when they have come, they will be past. But "Thou art always the Selfsame and thy years shall have no end." Thy years neither go nor come; but ours both go and come in order that all separate moments may come to pass. All thy years stand together as one, since they are abiding. Nor do thy years past exclude the years to come because thy years do not pass away. All these years of ours shall be with thee, when all of them shall have ceased to be. Thy years are but a day, and thy day is not recurrent, but always today.
Thy "today" yields not to tomorrow and does not follow yesterday. Thy "today" is eternity.[1]
—St. Augustine,
Confessions, Book XI, Chapter XIII
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_and_eternity (not trying to use Wikipedia as a source, it was just the quickest place I could find this quote with references)
I cannot make any sense of this. Not only that, but it doesn't appear to be Scriptural at all. The Scriptures say:
"Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever thou hadst formed the earth and the world, even from everlasting (olam) to everlasting (olam), thou
art God.
Thou turnest man to destruction; and sayest, Return, ye children of men.
For a thousand years (not eternity) in thy sight
are but as yesterday when it is past, and
as a watch in the night." Psalm 90:2
"But, beloved,
be not ignorant of this one thing, that
one day is with the Lord
as a thousand years, and
a thousand years as
one day." 2 Peter 3:8
Augustine does not say this. He takes it even further to say that one day is eternity to God. Since time is relative, then the Scriptures appear to make much more sense than eternal. The Scriptures say that God is Light, and I believe this is why God does not create Light, He forms it:
"I
form the light, and
create darkness: I
make peace, and
create evil: I the LORD do all these
things." Isaiah 45:7
In the beginning, when God created the Heavens and the Earth, there was darkness of the surface of the deep. Then God says "let there be Light". The Scriptures never say that God created Light, so Light is likewise a property of God. (Genesis is much deeper than this, as I do believe in an eternal
quality that I will discuss later)
I would translate "eon" as "time". God of the times sounds divine to me.
Things are not hard for God in terms of muscle. But things can be trying for him when mankind plays too foul, although with will he sets himself through. God is always strong but he is also tenderhearted and can be frustrated. But God is Spirit and almighty.
The reason I quoted L. Ray Smith is because he has a great video about this. I will try to summarize it.
Genesis 1:1 says "In the beginning". The word "beginning" is
ראשׁית and it means:
Strong's Definition: From the same as H7218; the first, in place, time, order or rank (specifically a firstfruit): - beginning, chief (-est), first (-fruits, part, time),
principal thing.
In Proverbs, we are told:
"Wisdom is the principal thing;
therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding." Proverbs 4:7
So, Genesis 1:1 could read:
"In Wisdom God created the heavens and the earth." (Compare to Jeremiah 10:12, Jeremiah 51:15, Proverbs 3:19, Psalm 104:24)
Now I'll be the first to admit that this is a stretch, but if we look into Wisdom, we find some interesting things:
"The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old.
I was set up from everlasting (olam), from the beginning, or ever the earth was.
When
there were no depths, I was
brought forth (
חוּל); when
there were no fountains abounding with water." Proverbs 8:22
The Hebrew
חוּל that is translated "brought forth" means to twist or writhe in pain; especially childbirth.
This is interesting. Before the world could be made, God had to know how to do it. He had to obtain Wisdom. This was not just something He has always possessed, but something He had to obtain through much pain and suffering.
Now consider what Yeshua tells us:
"For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay
them on men's shoulders;
but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers." Matthew 23:4
Yeshua basically coined the word hypocrite to mean someone who says one thing but does another. I believe God suffers, and has suffered. And His suffering is exponentially greater than our suffering. Just as His Love is infinitely greater than ours.
Does God change? I would not dismiss this so easily. Jesus is a part of God and the incarnation was something new where God had a personal experience of life. God does not change in his inclination to love, but the intensity of his love has changed during the ages before and after the incarnation and the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.
Although I disagree with this premise, this is exactly what I'm talking about. If God is eternal, then He cannot change. He cannot go from point A to point B, because this would require movement. So, this is not to say that God does not change, but rather He does not change His mind (now that He has obtained Wisdom). If God cannot change from point A to point B, then there was no specific time that He created the Universe. This would require Him to have lived for all eternity (past, present, future combined), and yet He had to at some point "decide" to create the Universe.
Actually, eternity is one of the problems I have with the trinity. The church teaches that Yeshua is God, but the Scriptures say Yeshua was begotten. Therefore, the church has reasoned that Yeshua is "eternally begotten". I have asked several people what this means, but I have never heard a reasonable answer. Just that it's a "mystery".
God's longsuffering comes from being righteous in love. He considers himself and makes known himself as someone holy, and holiness is a claim of steadfastness.
I can understand this if God is everlasting or immortal, but I don't see how God can longsuffer if He is eternal. If God is eternal, then He has suffered in the past, suffers in the present, will suffer in the future, and His suffering has ceased. This would mean that God suffers at all times, yet He never suffers again. This appears to be a contradiction, and my mind loathes contradictions.
Interaction can be through prayer or through study of both the writings and nature. When you pray you can also talk back, like in theater. I do that with tongue speaking and then I interpret. Various input to get through this.
What I mean is, how can God interact within time, if the moment has already happened? This would make us eternal as well. If God talked to Moses on Mount Sinai, and a day it still eternity to God, then He never ceased talking to Moses. Would this not imply that Moses is still standing on Mount Sinai?
This means if we pray, He has already heard our prayers. I believe God knows beforehand what we will pray about, and the Scriptures say he knows what we need before we ask. But I believe this is because God works all things, not because He has already experienced it.
Did God learn evil? I don't know ... I cannot answer this question. I suppose God always knew everything. Maybe there were other intelligent races before mankind.
God bless you! Greetings from Germany,
Daniel
Ecclesiastes tells us that it is the experience of evil that God has set upon the sons of man to be humbled therewith (
Ecclesiastes 1:13 original Hebrew). If you click on the verse, it'll take you to an interlinear. Notice that the word "
רָ֗ע ra" is translated "very" in the interlinear. The KJV translates this word "sore". Rah means evil, and it always means evil.
Like I said earlier, I do not believe God has subjected us to something that He is unwilling to experience Himself. However, I'm not sure if God experienced Evil before He created the Universe, or if He began experiencing Evil when He created the Universe, since Scripture says He creates Evil.
I hope you do not think I am mocking anyone. These are questions that I'm asking myself as well as I try to understand this. In the beginning was the Logos, and the Logos was with God. Logos is Logic, Reason, and God's Word. For this reason, I believe it is completely logical to believe in God, including any understanding of what God is. So please bear with me. If I appear to be mocking, I do not mean to whatsoever.
Thank you Daniel and God bless you my friend.
