Can 'Christians' be members of SECRET societies?

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timewerx

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Not one time have I ever seen a mockery of MM in any Masonic function.


If someone mocked or insulted you with a warm smile in a language you do not understand, doesn't mean no offense ever took place.

Repeat those words you do not understand to someone who knows the language and even with a warm smile, a right hook will be coming right at you!

The symbols we are talking about are primordial. Even if I never said anything evil about it, you should feel something about it because it touches our primordial origins. If you felt nothing about it, you likely belong to it and nothing else can be done.
 
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americanvet

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I am a Freemason. This has been establish for a while on this site. I will say again there is nothing in Masonry that mocks Christ. Is your last sentence implying there is a force more powerful than God since you said "nothing else can be done"? It sounds like you say I'm lost without any hope for salvation.

Side note: Please don't change what I wrote when quoting me.
 
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Albion

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Good works are good by themselves. What about the symbols used by Freemasons?
We were speaking of 'works,' were we not? How does jumping to 'symbols used' logically follow as part of that discussion??

In my independent analysis you won't find anywhere in the internet, they represent forms of the fall of creation, they are very ancient. They are symbols of the fallen watchers and were first found in Babylon and the more ancient Sumerians and it is possibly way way older. It couldn't just be ignored even if the resemblance is not 100% but a close 90% and quite endemic (a "wolf in sheep's clothing"?), it's sending a clear message

The "all-seeing-eye" or the circle/sphere represents Christ or ideals of Christ. The same eye bound within a pyramid or a hexagram (or a square and compass) represents the ideals of Christ bound by the ideals of the fallen watchers.

The symbol symbolizes the mockery of Christ or His Word.

There is another symbol that is rather quite popular in Christianity and I won't mention it.
As you said, that's your independent analysis. You assign a meaning to some of these images based on nothing but your own hunch. Upon reflection, you should realize that you are pretty much shooting in the dark there, and even the same symbol can have significantly different meaning, depending upon which organization is using it...and that depends upon what meaning the organization has assigned to it.

My point is, why would you do good works and mock Christ at the same time??
I'd say you wouldn't. And the Freemasons don't. It would be contrary to its own standards. Common sense should tell you that this thesis of yours is defective, considering that most Masons are Christians.
 
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fat wee robin

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Good works are good by themselves. What about the symbols used by Freemasons? In my independent analysis you won't find anywhere in the internet, they represent forms of the fall of creation, they are very ancient. They are symbols of the fallen watchers and were first found in Babylon and the more ancient Sumerians and it is possibly way way older. It couldn't just be ignored even if the resemblance is not 100% but a close 90% and quite endemic (a "wolf in sheep's clothing"?), it's sending a clear message

The "all-seeing-eye" or the circle/sphere represents Christ or ideals of Christ. The same eye bound within a pyramid or a hexagram (or a square and compass) represents the ideals of Christ bound by the ideals of the fallen watchers.

The symbol symbolizes the mockery of Christ or His Word.

There is another symbol that is rather quite popular in Christianity and I won't mention it.



My point is, why would you do good works and mock Christ at the same time?? Does that sound right? It seems like the most convoluted thing imaginable.

Can the Freemasons be excused in their ignorance of the symbols they use??

Perhaps the symbol has by legend used by King Solomon to control demons because of what it represents if used in the guise of good works. It just fails to make sense and confuses even the demons - by doing good works and mocking Christ at the same time.
Don't know very much about this kind of thing ,but what you are saying helps us to understand certain things .
Could you please rewrite that last part with Solomon as it is not clear,there is something missing ,thankyou .
 
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timewerx

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As you said, that's your independent analysis. You assign a meaning to some of these images based on nothing but your own hunch. Upon reflection, you should realize that you are pretty much shooting in the dark there, and even the same symbol can have significantly different meaning, depending upon which organization is using it...and that depends upon what meaning the organization has assigned to it.

You are now looking for what is esoteric. THis is something even the Freemasons are ignorant of.

Unfortunately, I cannot tell it for it will deprive you of that opportunity to wake up from your own nightmare. You have to figure it out by yourself or in time, the truth will come out from someone else none of you will be able to refute.
 
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timewerx

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there is a force more powerful than God since you said "nothing else can be done"? It sounds like you say I'm lost without any hope for salvation.

That force is your overriding will.

Our mind is like a ball placed atop a pyramid, it doesn't take much to push it out of place to a place beyond hope. Which is why we must be careful with the things we have come to accept.

There is a reset button however, you just have to find it.
 
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americanvet

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That force is your overriding will.

Our mind is like a ball placed atop a pyramid, it doesn't take much to push it out of place to a place beyond hope. Which is why we must be careful with the things we have come to accept.

There is a reset button however, you just have to find it.

No I do not need a reset button. I have a Savior.
 
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timewerx

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No I do not need a reset button. I have a Savior.

Christ is the reset button, clean slate!

But only few will find the real Christ. So it's probably not a good idea to fill our lives with junk when looking for something that's hard to find!
 
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timewerx

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Don't know very much about this kind ofthing ,but what you are saying helps us to understand certain things .
Could you please rewrite that last part with Solomon as it is not clear,there is something missing ,thankyou .

If you see someone cheerfully helping others, being charitable to the poor while cursing God at the same time with their lips. That would certainly come out as something horrifying!

That can be the result of using icons that could mean opposite of what we think to be good.

This is probably why religious icons are knocked down by spirits. It simply confuses them for having opposing meanings.

There are other popular religions out there who uses the same concept, to the disadvantage of their unwitting members.



We are being played along for the most part it's no longer that easy to determine who your real enemies or real friends are.

We have been instructed to become wise as serpents, I really think we should take Christ's advice seriously! We should let go of our meaningless ways!
 
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americanvet

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Christ is the reset button, clean slate!

But only few will find the real Christ. So it's probably not a good idea to fill our lives with junk when looking for something that's hard to find!

We agree. However, our understanding of what you said is very different.
 
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Albion

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You are now looking for what is esoteric. THis is something even the Freemasons are ignorant of.
Look, you have your theories, but you don't know Masonry from personal experience so you're guessing up and down the line. HOWEVER, it doesn't matter much because Masonry is NOT the topic here. It only came up as an example, and an invalid one at that. The topic is whether Christians can belong to Secret Societies.

Let's talk about whether Christians can rightly belong to Secret Societies!
 
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timewerx

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Let's talk about whether Christians can rightly belong to Secret Societies!

If anyone has read the Clementine Homilies, Apostle Peter established the Early Christianity with some similarities to a secret society.

It's not much of a ritualistic based movement but the dissemination of the secrets of the Kingdom through discernment unlike the process of initiation which common in the Occult.

Materials containing these information were hidden.



Christians should be aware that Apostle Peter was placed in charge by Christ but when the New Testament was shown to be the contrary, with Apostle James in charge, with Apostle Paul, filling most of the NT, something's amiss.

Jesus also practiced revelation through discernment, He even gave instructions not to preach in towns that does not welcome His disciples, preached in parables, etc. The rest of the NT we have in the Bible is a contradiction. With the Clementine homilies being a lot more agreeable to the Christ in the Gospels.
 
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Jaxxi

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I am a Freemason. This has been establish for a while on this site. I will say again there is nothing in Masonry that mocks Christ. Is your last sentence implying there is a force more powerful than God since you said "nothing else can be done"? It sounds like you say I'm lost without any hope for salvation.

Side note: Please don't change what I wrote when quoting me.
If you have ever said We meet this day to commemorate the death of our 'Most Wise and Perfect Master,' not as inspired or divine, for this is not for us to decide, but as at least the greatest of the apostles of mankind." or"This is indeed a sad day, for we have lost our Master. We may never see him again. He is dead! Mourn, weep and cry, for he is gone." and then blown out a candle...while wearing a long black hooded robe then you have snuffed out Christ. Any religion that has secret ceremonies behind closed doors is not of the Living God who is truth and light.
 
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Albion

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Any religion that has secret ceremonies behind closed doors is not of the Living God who is truth and light.

Well, that's what the early Christians did. In fact, that's what the early Christians had to do in order to escape the Roman authorities. So I'm not sure that I accept your theory. But the topic is not really about other religions anyway, but about whether Christians (that's their religion) should also belong to Secret Societies.
 
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timewerx

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Well, that's what the early Christians did. In fact, that's what the early Christians had to do in order to escape the Roman authorities. So I'm not sure that I accept your theory. But the topic is not really about other religions anyway, but about whether Christians (that's their religion) should also belong to Secret Societies.


Even if Christianity is a secret society, do you think it would be appropriate to join OTHER secret societies?
 
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Albion

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Even if Christianity is a secret society, do you think it would be appropriate to join OTHER secret societies?
Christianity is NOT a Secret Society, but it once kept its worship services private, both for self-defense from a hostile government and also because it felt that some of its worship was so precious that anyone lacking a commitment and an appropriate preparation should not be allowed to participate. IOW, secrecy is not contrary to Christianity. But a "Secret Society" is something else.

Whether Christians compromise anything in the Christian religion by belonging to any Secret Society is the issue here, but as for the answer, I'd say it depends mainly on what the Secret Society in question is doing or what it requires of its members. There is no "one-answer-fits-all" resolution to this question.
 
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Albion

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This thread makes my head and heart hurt.
Quite possibly, it wouldn't do that if most of the posts actually addressed the topic of the thread instead of rambling on about Egyptian symbols, people who keep secrets, and other extraneous matters, instead of dealing with some real secret societies and what those posters think is contrary to Christianity with them (if anything). :sigh:
 
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timewerx

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I'd say it depends mainly on what the Secret Society in question is doing or what it requires of its members. There is no "one-answer-fits-all" resolution to this question.

So you are saying, there's always a chance, it will be bad.

So why take that risk?

The fact that you are obviously not an expert on symbols, rituals of other beliefs, perhaps you should err on the side of caution/safety, am I correct?

So why even bother? Do we lose anything by NOT joining any of these highly ritualized groups?? We lose nothing!

So what about Freemason's charitable initiatives? You can simply join other humanitarian groups that are non-ritual in nature.... Can't you see it's a trap, to fool you into their good works and snared into their rituals?

What else is left? The answer is clearly vanity.


And finally, the answer is NO! No to all ritualistic groups, which clearly includes secret societies, brotherhoods, fraternities, etc, which clearly includes Freemasonry.


instead of rambling on about Egyptian symbols

Freemason's use of a few Egyptian symbols like the Eye and the Pyramid is a bastardization of the old and ancient Egyptian religion. It is an insult to a once great civilization, how??

Freemasonry originally was an all-male group and still is a predominantly male group even if they now have female members.

The really ancient Egyptian religion (even earlier than the Jewish fairy tales) is either Matriarchal or of mixed, equal gender status.

This fact, clearly reveals Freemasonry's connection with Judaism in their ancient hatred of Matriarchy or of equal existence with anything female.

Another religion who bastardized Ancient Egypt religion is Islam with their adaptation of the Star and Crescent symbol which is originally a prominent symbol in Ancient Egypt, can represent either Isis or Ma'at both of whom parallels Christ in many things.

Sacred Egyptian symbols are widespread today being represented by the WRONG people, including in Christianity. This is not something to be taken lightly.
 
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