On wishing there were no Hell (moved)

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If I become a Christian, I'll face a necessity that surely must have been an obstacle for Christian converts before me– I can't be the only person in the world who wants to love God with all their heart, but wishes that Hell didn't exist. And while I sometimes lean towards annihilationism, I know that the prevailing opinion among Christians is that whoever isn't saved (with possible exceptions for young children, etc)– whoever isn't in Christ at the moment of their deaths– will suffer for eternity in literal or metaphorical fire.

I (almost) know– and want deeply to believe with all my heart– that everything God does is good and just, that if God created Hell or allowed it to come into being, then I am in the wrong to be upset or distraught by it. But it's still so hard to align my own sense of things with the fact that Hell is a work of supreme justice and supreme goodness.

Because I can't think of a single person, real or hypothetical, who deserves, in my eyes, to be tortured forever. I'd rather see Hitler and Stalin, rapists and murderers, enter Heaven than see a single soul thrown into Hell. That's my gut feeling. I must be wrong, but it's my gut feeling.

And that is, of course, to say nothing of my fear that I'll go to Hell– a fear that's hounded me since I became an agnostic and diminished noticeably only when I started thinking about God positively and hoping for Heaven.

So here are my questions: Is it wrong of me to wish that Hell didn't exist? Should I somehow make myself happy that it does? Should I just accept that I can't appreciate every aspect of God's goodness and leave it at that? And furthermore, does the existence of Hell trouble you at all? Do you feel any unease at the notion that people, people in the same sense that you and I are people, are going to experience unending agony? Is it a sin to feel such an unease? If so, how does one get rid of it?

If you think I ask to many questions here, you should see what I do to my poor dear mother.
 
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directory

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Why would an infinitely Holy, Righteous and Just God want to have sinful and rebellious people in His Heaven?
I know that argument, of course (and can think of a good way to counter it, but that's for another thread), but I'm not asking for a justification of the existence of Hell. As I said in my post, I know that in any disagreement between God and I, I'm the one who's wrong. I'm asking if other people feel displeasure at the notion that some human beings are suffering (or will suffer) for eternity. My point is that I know the arguments for the justice of Hell, but still can't help wishing that it didn't exist, because I can't bring myself to want people, no matter what they've thought or done, to be tortured forever. How do I deal with the fact that the God I want to believe in, adore, and worship is the God who allows or ordains a thing that upsets me, emotionally, as much as Hell does?
 
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directory

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I see exactly what you mean, but that doesn't make my position much easier– I know that a just God wouldn't let sinners into Heaven, and I don't want sinners to enter Heaven, but the fact that those sinners are going to experience everlasting agony doesn't make me happy. My whole point is that even though I know that God is just in all He does and therefore shouldn't question Hell if Hell exists, the idea of eternal suffering causes me emotional pain, and the point of this thread is that I want to know if that emotional pain is sinful or not.
 
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RC1970

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I see exactly what you mean, but that doesn't make my position much easier– I know that a just God wouldn't let sinners into Heaven, and I don't want sinners to enter Heaven, but the fact that those sinners are going to experience everlasting agony doesn't make me happy. My whole point is that even though I know that God is just in all He does and therefore shouldn't question Hell if Hell exists, the idea of eternal suffering causes me emotional pain, and the point of this thread is that I want to know if that emotional pain is sinful or not.

No it is not sinful to weep for the wicked. The Bible tells us that God does not delight in the destruction of the wicked.

I agree with you in the general question of "why doesn't God save everyone?", but the reality is that He doesn't. He does what pleases Him, not what pleases us.

I do think that when we arrive in Heaven, we will understand all these things more clearly.
 
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DavidPL

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I don't think that it is wrong of you to wish that hell did not exist because I don't think God wants to send people to hell and that's why He is so quick to forgive if we accept Him and repent. We will never fully be able to understand certain things and part of being a Christian is putting your faith in God rather than your own understandings. The existence of hell absolutely troubles me because I know that place will not be empty and all those who are without Christ will go there. Feelings are never sinful, however what we do with those feelings may lead to sinful behavior. Personally, I don't believe in a physical hell because I think that our physical presence is here on earth and our spirit will either be going to heaven or hell. It seems that the Bible is using fire as a metaphor, rather than a literal definition because throughout the Bible fire has always been symbolic of refinement, not punishment. God sends people away from Him because they are not His children unless they have accepted Christ as their savior, and as such they are descendants of Adam and are under the full penalty of the law for which they could never do enough good works to get themselves out of. However when they accept Christ they are adopted away from Adam and given to God and at that point they have accepted the sacrifice that Christ made for them and are now found innocent. That's why God says salvation is through grace, not works.
 
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graceandpeace

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If I become a Christian, I'll face a necessity that surely must have been an obstacle for Christian converts before me– I can't be the only person in the world who wants to love God with all their heart, but wishes that Hell didn't exist. And while I sometimes lean towards annihilationism, I know that the prevailing opinion among Christians is that whoever isn't saved (with possible exceptions for young children, etc)– whoever isn't in Christ at the moment of their deaths– will suffer for eternity in literal or metaphorical fire.

I (almost) know– and want deeply to believe with all my heart– that everything God does is good and just, that if God created Hell or allowed it to come into being, then I am in the wrong to be upset or distraught by it. But it's still so hard to align my own sense of things with the fact that Hell is a work of supreme justice and supreme goodness.

Because I can't think of a single person, real or hypothetical, who deserves, in my eyes, to be tortured forever. I'd rather see Hitler and Stalin, rapists and murderers, enter Heaven than see a single soul thrown into Hell. That's my gut feeling. I must be wrong, but it's my gut feeling.

And that is, of course, to say nothing of my fear that I'll go to Hell– a fear that's hounded me since I became an agnostic and diminished noticeably only when I started thinking about God positively and hoping for Heaven.

So here are my questions: Is it wrong of me to wish that Hell didn't exist? Should I somehow make myself happy that it does? Should I just accept that I can't appreciate every aspect of God's goodness and leave it at that? And furthermore, does the existence of Hell trouble you at all? Do you feel any unease at the notion that people, people in the same sense that you and I are people, are going to experience unending agony? Is it a sin to feel such an unease? If so, how does one get rid of it?

If you think I ask to many questions here, you should see what I do to my poor dear mother.

Modern Christian views on hell seem to vary. I think you will find many Mainline Protestants who either question or reject the idea of "eternal conscious torment."

Reading the Gospels, Jesus spends far more time talking about the Kingdom of God. We are called to help set things right in our world. It seems apparent that Jesus did believe in some sort of possible exclusion from the Kingdom - but what that exclusion looks like, or how long it lasts, is something that seems unclear.

There are a few different words that are translated in the Gospels as "hell" in many Bible versions. One refers to a burning garbage dump. The other refers to the grave. For me, it is difficult to know what to do with that. Jesus used hyperbole often, & again I think it seems he did believe in some sort of possible exclusion.

Christians do believe that Jesus conquered death & that our hope in him revolves both around the restoration of our own beings into relationship with God, as well as the redemption of all things - everything in creation, the cosmos. That is the fullness of the Kingdom of God finally realized. Can one be excluded, & if so what does that mean? Again, for me it seems unclear.

One thing my church's priest said has stuck with me. He said that he thinks the only person who won't be forgiven is the person who won't accept forgiveness. What becomes of the person who won't accept forgiveness? What becomes of the person who actively seeks to destroy others, destroy the earth, destroy themselves?

All of these reflections, these questions, are worth considering. For me, I believe I must refrain from judging others, & must place my emphasis on Jesus's focus - the Kingdom of God. Feed the hungry, comfort the lonely, & otherwise seek to be the "hands & feet" of my Savior.
 
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oi_antz

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And while I sometimes lean towards annihilationism, I know that the prevailing opinion among Christians is that whoever isn't saved (with possible exceptions for young children, etc)– whoever isn't in Christ at the moment of their deaths– will suffer for eternity in literal or metaphorical fire.
Please insist on scriptural support for these doctrines. Keep in mind that Christians learn what they are taught before they learn from God, and by that time they are accustomed to read scriptures in context supporting the doctrines they are taught, and then they harden their hearts to His correction.

Scriptures speak about a second death. Scriptures speak about burning chaff and weeds with unquenchable fire. I have never seen anything survive fire before. Yes, as I have read scriptures, independent of and contrary to the doctrines I was taught, all indicate ultimate annihilation for the unregenerate, also described as the second death, the lake of fire. There is Revelation 14:11 which speaks of a very specific class of people. Because it stands so starkly against the rest of scripture, it serves a solemn warning to everyone about entering the regime described.
Because I can't think of a single person, real or hypothetical, who deserves, in my eyes, to be tortured forever.
Or tortured for a moment. Not a single scripture describes torture in hell.
And that is, of course, to say nothing of my fear that I'll go to Hell– a fear that's hounded me since I became an agnostic and diminished noticeably only when I started thinking about God positively and hoping for Heaven.
Yeah, well, I suppose it isn't beyond His ability, is it? After all, what can we do but trust Him? So far, He appears to be truly good, based on a fair view of the evidence.
So here are my questions: Is it wrong of me to wish that Hell didn't exist?
I reckon not.
Should I somehow make myself happy that it does?
No. Be honest with Him. He hates liars and deceivers. He would rather hear your grievances so He can comfort you.
Should I just accept that I can't appreciate every aspect of God's goodness and leave it at that?
I think it is good to acknowledge that your capacity to understand and therefore appreciate His goodness is still growing. In my experience, after several years of it, this appreciation of His goodness keeps growing if we tend to it.
And furthermore, does the existence of Hell trouble you at all?
Immensely. It is tragic, so heart breaking, and for me alone who knows only a handful of people, yet God knows and loves every single one intimately. I reckon nobody can ever know grief like He does.
Do you feel any unease at the notion that people, people in the same sense that you and I are people, are going to experience unending agony?
I do not believe He will necessarily do that, yes though that idea does make me uneasy.
Is it a sin to feel such an unease?
I suggest probably it is love, and not sin at all.
If so, how does one get rid of it?
Trust Him, and learn the truth. John 8:12, John 8:31-32.
If you think I ask to many questions here, you should see what I do to my poor dear mother.
You are on track :thumbsup:
 
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