Exactly what part of the Law has been abolished?

Christ fulfilled the ceremonial law completely and so it is abolished. He takes the place of the ceremonial aspects and becomes our perfect sacrifice. The rest of the law still applies and we must seek Christ in faith to remedy or sin.

The law refers to works, and salvation is not by works (Romans 3), but faith and a relationship with the Savior ---Jesus, the Christ of God. It is interesting to see that all the Ten Commandments of the Old Testament are found in the New Testament to be kept (except the ordinance to Israel to keep the Sabbath); and these commandments for Israel are standards for the Church to hold, but not as law, but grace and privilege to honor God. The Bride of Christ (the Church) is not under law, but grace, so one should receive the blessing and privilege as found in Jesus Christ, or one will forfeit it by turning from the Savior.

Don't see any Christians sacrificing their pet in penance of their sins.

That's one part of the Law gone, I suppose.

The Law and its Temple is called "heaven and earth".

The Law was destroyed along with the Temple.

Gideon said:

St Paul, speaking in the context of Jew and Gentile being brought together, declares that the "law of commandments" were abolished.

"For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two." (Ephesians 2:15)

Exactly what law (or part of law) is that which is 'expressed in ordinances', and abolished? Is he referring to the Mosaic system in its entirety, or does it only refer to the ceremonial aspects pertaining to feasts and temple sacrifices.

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in 2 Cor 3 we read that the ten commandment s also are abolished for the believer.
Believers are dead to the law free from the law etc, not under the law

Gideon said:

St Paul, speaking in the context of Jew and Gentile being brought together, declares that the "law of commandments" were abolished.

"For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two." (Ephesians 2:15)

Exactly what law (or part of law) is that which is 'expressed in ordinances', and abolished? Is he referring to the Mosaic system in its entirety, or does it only refer to the ceremonial aspects pertaining to feasts and temple sacrifices.

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No part of God's law has been abolished because heaven and earth have not passed away and not all has been accomplished (Matthew 5:17-19). Furthermore, it wouldn't make any sense to say in Ephesians 2:10 that we are new creations in Christ for the purpose of doing good works, which the law instructs, only to say a few verses later that Christ abolished his instructions for how to do good works. We have no need for those instructions to be abolished and should not desire it to be the case because it should be our privilege and our delight to obey them.

What is being referred to are the man-made laws, such as in Acts 10:28 that prohibited Jews from visiting or associating Gentiles and the man-made wall in the Temple that prohibited Gentiles from worshipping with Jews on pain of death. God did not intend for there to be these divisions between Jews and Gentiles, but rather He commanded for them to love Gentiles as themselves (Leviticus 19:34). Consistently throughout the Bible man-made laws are rejected while God's laws are upheld.

In the surrounding context of Ephesians 2:15, Gentiles were once separated from Christ, alienated from Israel, foreigners to the covenant, and without hope (Ephesians 2:12), but all of that is no longer true. They are no longer foreigners, but are now fellow citizens of Israel, members of the covenant, and with hope (Ephesians 2:19). So this is speaking of breaking down what was preventing Gentiles from being joined with Israel, not about God's holy, righteous, and good laws being abolished.

1watchman said:

The law refers to works, and salvation is not by works (Romans 3), but faith and a relationship with the Savior ---Jesus, the Christ of God. It is interesting to see that all the Ten Commandments of the Old Testament are found in the New Testament to be kept (except the ordinance to Israel to keep the Sabbath); and these commandments for Israel are standards for the Church to hold, but not as law, but grace and privilege to honor God. The Bride of Christ (the Church) is not under law, but grace, so one should receive the blessing and privilege as found in Jesus Christ, or one will forfeit it by turning from the Savior.

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Moses could not have used the fact that the law doesn't bring salvation as an excuse not to obey God's law, and neither can we - that was not the purpose for which the law was given. It was intended to instruct how to have a holy, righteous, and good conduct by faith, and indeed it is a privilege to honor God, but it is more than privilege because those who do not have a righteous conduct are not children of God (1 John 3:10). God's grace is in regard to the forgiveness of sins and providing a way for salvation, not in exempting us from having to obey God's laws.

random person said:

The Law and its Temple is called "heaven and earth".

The Law was destroyed along with the Temple.

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Can you quote a source? That interpretation would make Jesus' statement tautological and wouldn't really fit with the rest of the Bible.

Soyeong said:

Can you quote a source? That interpretation would make Jesus' statement tautological and wouldn't really fit with the rest of the Bible.

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Deuteronomy 32:1 (Israel is heaven and earth)

Isaiah 51:15-16 (Israel is heaven and earth)

Jeremiah 31:35-36 (Israel is heaven and earth)

Matthew 5:17-18

Matthew 21:43

Other nations whose political and religious bodies have been called "heaven and earth":

Babylon's "heaven and earth" passed away Isaiah 13:9-13
Egypt's "heaven and earth" passed away Ezekiel 32:7-8
Edom's "heaven and earth" passed away Isaiah 34:4-5
Israel's "heaven and earth" passed away Matthew 5:17-18, Matthew 24:29-30, Hebrews 12:26-27, 2 Peter 3:7-12

Gideon said:

St Paul, speaking in the context of Jew and Gentile being brought together, declares that the "law of commandments" were abolished.

"For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two." (Ephesians 2:15)

Exactly what law (or part of law) is that which is 'expressed in ordinances', and abolished? Is he referring to the Mosaic system in its entirety, or does it only refer to the ceremonial aspects pertaining to feasts and temple sacrifices.

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Both relate to the law of our mind/soul that brings us into bondage; for the mind of Christ as a possession, there is no law, having become it.

Soyeong said:

No part of God's law has been abolished because heaven and earth have not passed away and not all has been accomplished (Matthew 5:17-19). Furthermore, it wouldn't make any sense to say in Ephesians 2:10 that we are new creations in Christ for the purpose of doing good works, which the law instructs, only to say a few verses later that Christ abolished his instructions for how to do good works. We have no need for those instructions to be abolished and should not desire it to be the case because it should be our privilege and our delight to obey them.

What is being referred to are the man-made laws, such as in Acts 10:28 that prohibited Jews from visiting or associating Gentiles and the man-made wall in the Temple that prohibited Gentiles from worshipping with Jews on pain of death. God did not intend for there to be these divisions between Jews and Gentiles, but rather He commanded for them to love Gentiles as themselves (Leviticus 19:34). Consistently throughout the Bible man-made laws are rejected while God's laws are upheld.

In the surrounding context of Ephesians 2:15, Gentiles were once separated from Christ, alienated from Israel, foreigners to the covenant, and without hope (Ephesians 2:12), but all of that is no longer true. They are no longer foreigners, but are now fellow citizens of Israel, members of the covenant, and with hope (Ephesians 2:19). So this is speaking of breaking down what was preventing Gentiles from being joined with Israel, not about God's holy, righteous, and good laws being abolished.

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It is often said there are 613 laws in the OT. Do you follow them all?

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ken777 said:

It is often said there are 613 laws in the OT. Do you follow them all?

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Even at the time the laws were given, not all 613 of them were given to everyone, some were given to the King, High Priest, priests, judges, men, women, children, widows, people living in the land, foreigners living among them, and to everyone. Jesus didn't have menstrual cycles and didn't give birth, so not even he kept all 613 of them, but I try to keep those laws that apply to me as an expression of love and faith.

Soyeong said:

Even at the time the laws were given, not all 613 of them were given to everyone, some were given to the King, High Priest, priests, judges, men, women, children, widows, people living in the land, foreigners living among them, and to everyone. Jesus didn't have menstrual cycles and didn't give birth, so not even he kept all 613 of them, but I try to keep those laws that apply to me as an expression of love and faith.

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When I said "follow" I meant "accept as valid today". Your answer appears to be yes. Do you think all Christians should hold the same position?

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ken777 said:

When I said "follow" I meant "accept as valid today". Your answer appears to be yes. Do you think all Christians should hold the same position?

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Yes, it really should be straightforward that people who claim to be followers of God should follow His laws. The role of a disciple is to learn how to think and act like their rabbi, or to essentially become an imitation of them (1 Corinthians 11:1), so likewise it should be straightforward that people who claim to be disciples of Christ should seek to imitate his example of perfect obedience to God's laws. The law is God's instructions for how to have a holy, righteous, and good conduct and we are told to have a holy and righteous conduct (1 Peter 1:14-16, 1 John 3:10), so this again should be pretty straightforward. The law gives us knowledge of sin (Romans 3:20) we wouldn't know even know what sin was if it wasn't for the law (Romans 7:7), sin is defined as lawlessness (1 John 3:4), and we don't have a licence to sin (Romans 6:15), therefore...

Soyeong said:

Yes, it really should be straightforward that people who claim to be followers of God should follow His laws. The role of a disciple is to learn how to think and act like their rabbi, or to essentially become an imitation of them (1 Corinthians 11:1), so likewise it should be straightforward that people who claim to be disciples of Christ should seek to imitate his example of perfect obedience to God's laws. The law is God's instructions for how to have a holy, righteous, and good conduct and we are told to have a holy and righteous conduct (1 Peter 1:14-16, 1 John 3:10), so this again should be pretty straightforward. The law gives us knowledge of sin (Romans 3:20) we wouldn't know even know what sin was if it wasn't for the law (Romans 7:7), sin is defined as lawlessness (1 John 3:4), and we don't have a licence to sin (Romans 6:15), therefore...

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Thank you for explaining your position. Though I do not share it, I feel I understand it better now.

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The Bible clearly shows that God's law was not abolished in the New Testament.
The last books were written in the NT around 85-95 A.D over 50 years after Jesus's resurrection.
1John 2:3-4 - " Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. He who says I know Him
and does not keep His commandments, is a liar....."

The Book of Revelation also upholds keeping God's commandments- Rev 12:17, Rev 14:12.
Faith and keeping God's commandments go hand in hand as Paul stated in Romans 3:31

Jesus Christ gave us the final word on this in the last chapter of the Bible- " ......Blessed are those who do the commandments and will be rewarded according to their works ......"

Paul taught obedience to the law- 1 Cor 7:19, Romans 7:12. Romans 2:13

It is important that we believe only what Jesus said about the commandments of God. Once that is clear to us, then the reasonings and interpretations of men cannot deter us from respecting and obeying those commandments from the heart.

Jesus told us " If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love......." - John 15:10

The Ten Commandments are a necessary part of Christian living.
Let us do our part as commanded.

jacobs well said:

The Bible clearly shows that God's law was not abolished in the New Testament.
The last books were written in the NT around 85-95 A.D over 50 after after Jesus's resurrection.
1John 2:3-4 - " Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. He who says I know Him
and does not keep His commandments, is a liar....."

The Book of Revelation also upholds keeping God's commandments- Rev 12:17, Rev 14:12.
Faith and keeping God's commandments go hand in hand as Paul stated in Romans 3:31

Jesus Christ gave us the final word on this in the last chapter of the Bible- " ......Blessed are those who do the commandments and will be rewarded according to their works ......"

Paul taught obedience to the law- 1 Cor 7:19, Romans 7:12. Romans 2:13

It is important that we believe only what Jesus said about the commandments of God. Once that is clear to us, then the reasonings and interpretations of men cannot deter us from respecting and obeying those commandments from the heart.

Jesus told us " If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love......." - John 15:10

The Ten Commandments are a necessary part of Christian living.
Let us do our part as commanded.

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I was right behind everything you said until you needlessly limited God's commandments to just 10.

Why is the sabbath the only one of the 10 commandments always said to b unnecessary? It's still one of the 10

Soyeong said:

I was right behind everything you said until you needlessly limited God's commandments to just 10.

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Are you referring to John 13:34-35 in which Jesus's says " A new commandment I give to you that you love one another. as I have loved you.....".
I believe it shows that keeping God's commandments was an expression of love and does become a "new" and more encompassing command in governing human relationships
Does this 'new" Christian love do away or change any part of the Law (the Ten Commandments). I don't think so.
It magnifies the love Christians must have toward their fellow men. This new spiritual intent goes far beyond the letter of the Ten Commandments-but does not replace them.
Are there any OT commands we are to keep in the New Testament other then the 10 commandments?