St. Faustina and the Divine Mercy

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MikeK

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MikeK

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There are many saints on the calendar, but how many Sundays are named after a saint's private revelation like how the Church has Divine Mercy Sunday? Do you take Pope Francis' recent Papal Bull on the Divine Mercy with a grain of salt, too?I said it's not binding on Catholics in the OP of this thread. But I have a hard time understanding how anyone can believe in the prayer devotion of it without accepting the reason behind why the prayer devotion is being promoted. If I didn't believe that St. Faustina's private revelation was authentic I don't think I would see a reason why I should pray the prayer for it since there are many other prayers that the Catholic Church has such as the Rosary. Either it was actually Jesus that came to her and told her these things or it wasn't. I don't see how someone can believe that perhaps it was Jesus that appeared to her but that she didn't write down everything accurately. If it was Jesus that appeared to her I'm sure that He would have made sure that she got the message right. If it wasn't Jesus or if there is error in the message why did and does the Church approve it and not only approve it but aggressively promote devotion to it everywhere? I don't think it is logical to half way accept it. Either it's true or it's not. But since the Church doesn't approve every private revelation that comes along but is very selective about which private revelations she will approve I think it's safe to believe that this one is true.

I like the Rosary too, but I don't believe that every statement made by St Louis DeMontfort regarding must absolute truth. Pope Francis's Bull re the Divine Mercy was a beautiful statement on a beautiful feast and devotion. I am not aware of any other private revelations-turned Feast Days - though we do have Feast Days for Saints who may or may not have existed who were written about extensively by other Saints. Nothing ever happened until it happened for the first time, that alone is not remarkably significant to me. It is pretty cool though.

Regarding no Saint Faustina, what I do not believe (but also do not actively disbelieve) is her statement that souls are given another chance to repent of their sins after their death, before their judgement. This idea may be true, but it contradicts previous statements by Holy men stating that upon death there is no more opportunity to repent. I don't believe either to be true or false, and it matters little to me.
 
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Root of Jesse

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There are hundreds of Saints who have devotions on the Church Calendar. I have a strong devotion to the Divine Mercy, that neither means not implies that everything in St Faustina's diary was literal truth. There are several Doctors of the Church who have had far greater impacts on the Church than St Faustina, but they were errant on many of their teachings. That's okay, it isn't reason to fret or doubt.
St. Faustina is not a doctor of the Church, though...
Anyway, I'm reading her diary for a second time right now. I'm not investigating, anything, but just reading her experiences
 
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MikeK

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St. Faustina is not a doctor of the Church, though...
Anyway, I'm reading her diary for a second time right now. I'm not investigating, anything, but just reading her experiences

Correct. My point was that great Saints, and the Doctors are Saints, sometimes erred. Lots of Saints have reported lots of visions, and some seemingly contradict others. That's okay, they don't all have to be literally true in every aspect.
 
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LivingWordUnity

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I love the whole aspect of the divine mercy. It's surprising how many people don't believe in it. Or at least don't believe all of it. It's helped a lot with my faith.
And the fact that Catholics are free to disbelieve it doesn't mean they can tell the Catholics who do believe it that we are wrong.

I find it very interesting how the papacy of Pope Francis has had a theme of mercy right from the start, and then he issues a Papal Bull for a year dedicated to the Divine Mercy. It's also interesting how the Fatima apparitions of Our Lady placed emphasis on the 13th of the month. And not only was Pope Francis elected Pope in the 13th of the month, but he was also ordained a priest on the 13th of the month.
 
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pdudgeon

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Correct. My point was that great Saints, and the Doctors are Saints, sometimes erred. Lots of Saints have reported lots of visions, and some seemingly contradict others. That's okay, they don't all have to be literally true in every aspect.

had you ever considered that two people can look at the same scene and notice different things?
Without your giving examples of these seeming accounts that differ between the saints,
it would be difficult for anyone to draw an accurate conclusion.
 
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LivingWordUnity

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had you ever considered that two people can look at the same scene and notice different things?
Without your giving examples of these seeming accounts that differ between the saints,
it would be difficult for anyone to draw an accurate conclusion.
He usually doesn't give specifics unless it's related to politics.
 
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cmarie423

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And the fact that Catholics are free to disbelieve it doesn't mean they can tell the Catholics who do believe it that we are wrong.

I find it very interesting how the papacy of Pope Francis has had a theme of mercy right from the start, and then he issues a Papal Bull for a year dedicated to the Divine Mercy. It's also interesting how the Fatima apparitions of Our Lady placed emphasis on the 13th of the month. And not only was Pope Francis elected Pope in the 13th of the month, but he was also ordained a priest on the 13th of the month.

I always love connections like that. It may not mean anything but it's very interesting to say the least.
 
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LivingWordUnity

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I always love connections like that. It may not mean anything but it's very interesting to say the least.
Since Our Lady consistently told the children to meet her on the 13th of the month it had to have meaning. And numbers often have deep significance in Scripture. I thought it was very interesting when I only knew that Pope Francis was elected Pope on the 13th of the month. And then just a few months ago was when I found out that he was also ordained a priest on the 13th of the month. It seems like too many coincidences to be a coincidence.
 
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MikeK

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had you ever considered that two people can look at the same scene and notice different things?
Without your giving examples of these seeming accounts that differ between the saints,
it would be difficult for anyone to draw an accurate conclusion.

Of course they can, but two opposing things cannot both be correct. It may be that upon death, we have no more chances to repent of our sins. It may be that upon death, we will have another chance to accept salvation. It probably isn't both.
 
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LivingWordUnity

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Regarding no Saint Faustina, what I do not believe (but also do not actively disbelieve) is her statement that souls are given another chance to repent of their sins after their death, before their judgement. This idea may be true, but it contradicts previous statements by Holy men stating that upon death there is no more opportunity to repent. I don't believe either to be true or false, and it matters little to me.
What page in the diary is that on? And does it say this about someone who dies while attached to mortal sins? A person can repent of their venial sins while in Purgatory, and that's something that the Church says we can pray for.
 
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MikeK

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What page in the diary is that on? And does it say this about someone who dies while attached to mortal sins? A person can repent of their venial sins while in Purgatory, and that's something that the Church says we can pray for.

You can read her words re Jesus at the moment of death for yourself, I'm not looking them up, as I don't believe you are sincerely interested in a good faith discussion. Regarding what she says about people who are attached to mortal sins, she reports on souls who were awful but had only a "flicker of good" being saved, and of even the most hardened sinners recieving immeasurable graces for praying the Chaplet just once. She states the same for hardened sinners whom we pray the Chaplet for at the hour of their death.
 
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LivingWordUnity

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You can read her words re Jesus at the moment of death for yourself, I'm not looking them up, as I don't believe you are sincerely interested in a good faith discussion. Regarding what she says about people who are attached to mortal sins, she reports on sould who were awful but had only a "flicker of good" being saved, and of even the most hardened sinners recieving immeasurable graces for praying the Chaplet just once. She states the same for hardened sinners whom we pray the Chaplet for at the hour of their death.
I know that we don't get along. But I just want to read the part that you are talking about. I have the diary in my hands right now, so if you would like to tell me the page number I will look it up. "At the moment of death" and after death are two very different things. I think that perhaps you are confusing these two things in what it says in her diary.
 
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LivingWordUnity

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24. My thoughts now turn to the Mother of Mercy. May the sweetness of her countenance watch over us in this Holy Year, so that all of us may rediscover the joy of God’s tenderness. No one has penetrated the profound mystery of the incarnation like Mary. Her entire life was patterned after the presence of mercy made flesh. The Mother of the Crucified and Risen One has entered the sanctuary of divine mercy because she participated intimately in the mystery of His love.

Chosen to be the Mother of the Son of God, Mary, from the outset, was prepared by the love of God to be the Ark of the Covenant between God and man. She treasured divine mercy in her heart in perfect harmony with her Son Jesus. Her hymn of praise, sung at the threshold of the home of Elizabeth, was dedicated to the mercy of God which extends from “generation to generation” (Lk 1:50). We too were included in those prophetic words of the Virgin Mary. This will be a source of comfort and strength to us as we cross the threshold of the Holy Year to experience the fruits of divine mercy.

At the foot of the Cross, Mary, together with John, the disciple of love, witnessed the words of forgiveness spoken by Jesus. This supreme expression of mercy towards those who crucified him show us the point to which the mercy of God can reach. Mary attests that the mercy of the Son of God knows no bounds and extends to everyone, without exception. Let us address her in the words of the Salve Regina, a prayer ever ancient and ever new, so that she may never tire of turning her merciful eyes upon us, and make us worthy to contemplate the face of mercy, her Son Jesus.

Our prayer also extends to the saints and blessed ones who made divine mercy their mission in life. I think especially of the great apostle of mercy, Saint Faustina Kowalska. May she, who was called to enter the depths of divine mercy, intercede for us and obtain for us the grace of living and walking always according to the mercy of God and with an unwavering trust in his love.

Source:
Misericordiae Vultus - Bull of Indiction of the Extraordinary Jubilee of Mercy
 
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LivingWordUnity

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This was an intuition of Bl. John Paul II. He “sensed” that this was the time of mercy. We think of the Beatification and Canonization of Sr Faustina Kowalska; then he introduced the Feast of Divine Mercy. Little by little he advanced and went forward on this.

In his homily for the Canonization, which took place in 2000, John Paul II emphasized that the message of Jesus Christ to Sr Faustina is located, in time, between the two World Wars and is intimately tied to the history of the 20th century. And looking to the future he said: “What will the years ahead bring us? What will man’s future on earth be like? We are not given to know. However, it is certain that in addition to new progress there will unfortunately be no lack of painful experiences. But the light of divine mercy, which the Lord in a way wished to return to the world through Sr Faustina’s charism, will illumine the way for the men and women of the third millennium” (Homily, Sunday, 30 April 2000). It is clear. Here it is explicit, in 2000, but it was something that had been maturing in his heart for some time. Through his prayer, he had this intuition.

Today we forget everything far too quickly, even the Magisterium of the Church! Part of this is unavoidable, but we cannot forget the great content, the great intuitions and gifts that have been left to the People of God. And Divine Mercy is one of these. It is a gift which he gave to us, but which comes from above. It is up to us, as ministers of the Church, to keep this message alive, above all through preaching and in our actions, in signs and in pastoral choices, such as the decision to restore priority to the Sacrament of Reconciliation and to the works of mercy. Reconciliation, making peace through the Sacrament, also with words, and with works of mercy.

Source:
Address of Pope Francis to the Parish Priests of the Diocese of Rome (6 March 2014)
 
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MikeK

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Funny you should be arguing this. I noticed today a huge huge image of Divine Mercy hangs on the outside of the Church. It's like a billboar.

I haven't seen any billboards on Churches, but every Church I frequent has the Image of Divine Mercy prominently displayed. Obviously, the more Traditional parishes aren't as big on this particular devotion as some of the more modern minded, but nonetheless virtually everyone seems to appreciate this Saint and her works. I think a big part of the attraction to her teachings is the simplicity and ease of the other she teaches. So often, Catholics have been told that salvation comes though acts of penence and sacrifice and mortification. Saint Faustina suggests that Our Savior will be rather less harsh than many Catholics, particularly loser Catholics, have been led to belive. Of course, the SSPX and similar conservative, more-traditional-than-the-Pope groups don't recognize her Sainthood or celebrate the Feast.
 
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LivingWordUnity

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I haven't seen any billboards on Churches, but every Church I frequent has the Image of Divine Mercy prominently displayed. Obviously, the more Traditional parishes aren't as big on this particular devotion as some of the more modern minded, but nonetheless virtually everyone seems to appreciate this Saint and her works. I think a big part of the attraction to her teachings is the simplicity and ease of the other she teaches. So often, Catholics have been told that salvation comes though acts of penence and sacrifice and mortification. Saint Faustina suggests that Our Savior will be rather less harsh than many Catholics, particularly loser Catholics, have been led to belive. Of course, the SSPX and similar conservative, more-traditional-than-the-Pope groups don't recognize her Sainthood or celebrate the Feast.
I've never heard of a "loser Catholic." It sounds like a crass expression. Anyway, the message given to St. Faustina by Jesus is that His mercy is greater than His justice. But there's also a warning in it.

"He who refuses to pass through the door of My mercy must pass through the door of My Justice" (Diary 1146)

There's nothing in the message saying that Catholics don't need to do penance. It would be heresy, and it would not have been approved by the Church if it would have said that Catholics don't need penance. But the truth is that the message emphasizes the need for utilizing the sacrament of Penance. We should trust in God's mercy in extraordinary circumstances. But the sacrament of Penance is the ordinary means which God dispenses His mercy, so Catholics should not refuse it.

See the following:
The Extraordinary Graces of Divine Mercy Sunday

According to the Diary of St. Maria Faustina Kowalska, Jesus Christ made a special promise, which she was to communicate to the whole world:

My daughter, tell the whole world about My inconceivable mercy. I desire that the Feast of Mercy be a refuge and shelter for all souls, and especially for poor sinners. I pour out a whole ocean of graces upon those souls who approach the fount of My mercy (Diary, 699).​

In three places in her Diary, St. Faustina records a promise from our Lord of specific, extraordinary graces He will make available through the devout reception of Holy Communion on this Feast Day; truly a "whole ocean of graces" is contained in these promises:

I want to grant a complete pardon to the souls that will go to Confession and receive Holy Communion on the Feast of My mercy (1109).

Whoever approaches the Fount of Life on this day will be granted complete forgiveness of sins and punishment (300).

The soul that will go to Confession and receive Holy Communion will obtain complete forgiveness of sins and punishment (699).​

(Source)
 
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