Religious traditions that cause OCD

smaneck · Jul 29, 2015

Red Fox said:
I worried if I was truly saved or not. I worried if I committed the unforgivable sin or not.

That was precisely Luther's problem.

LoAmmi · Jul 29, 2015

smaneck said:
As you probably know Jehovah Witnesses don't allow blood transfusions since the Tanakh prohibits the eating of blood. I once asked the Jewish family I was living with at the time about this and if the very Orthodox Jews might also refuse blood transfusions for the same reason. I was told absolutely not for the Tanakh places the preservation of life above every other Law. The same principle holds in Islam.

I suppose that blood doping would be prohibited, but that's cheating anyhow.

Not over every other law. There are a few things we can't do just to preserve life. I can't worship another deity to save my life, for example. I also can't murder another person. There are only a few. Maybe three.

smaneck · Jul 29, 2015

cloudyday2 said:
Yep, religion seems to make people worry about silly things. I used to worry that God didn't like me and had preordained me to go to hell. I used to worry that I was the antichrist. I used to worry that I committed the unforgiveable sin. I worry a lot - even without religion.

That is good evidence that bad theology not practices and rituals that lead to scrupulosity.

smaneck · Jul 29, 2015

LoAmmi said:
Not over every other law. There are a few things we can't do just to preserve life. I can't worship another deity to save my life, for example. I also can't murder another person. There are only a few. Maybe three.

Yes, a Baha'i also should not deny their religion to save their life. We will also not engage in a jihad, even if defensive. But I think we could kill in self-defense under other circumstances.

cloudyday2 · Jul 29, 2015

smaneck said:
That is good evidence that bad theology not practices and rituals that lead to scrupulosity.

That is true. There are several ingredients. The person with scrupulosity must have some dire consequences to create the worry and theology supplies that. I personally suspect that rituals such as daily prayers would aggravate the OCD, but there are other ways. For example, an OCD person might have recurring arguments in his/her mind.

In general, an invisible God watching our every action, hearing our every thought, demanding our worship ... that can create psychological problems for some people.

cloudyday2 · Jul 29, 2015

Red Fox said:
No, it isn't all that strange once you know the story of my life. And I know nothing of being a Shaman.

If you would like to know more about me, then you can send me a private message and we can talk further.

Sorry you had to grow-up in that situation. I'm curious about your story, but I don't like private messages too much. I guess I'm just not a PM person IDK... Do you have a blog?

cloudyday2 · Jul 29, 2015

seashale76 said:
Anthropology 101: You do have a culture. However, when you're living in it, it's more difficult to perceive than other people's cultures.

True.

Red Fox · Jul 29, 2015

cloudyday2 said:
Sorry you had to grow-up in that situation. I'm curious about your story, but I don't like private messages too much. I guess I'm just not a PM person IDK... Do you have a blog?

No, I don't have a blog at this time.

cloudyday2 · Jul 29, 2015

Red Fox said:
No, I don't have a blog at this time.

I don't have one either. If I had a blog, I would probably have nothing to put on it except for pictures of my cat.

smaneck · Jul 29, 2015

cloudyday2 said:
In general, an invisible God watching our every action, hearing our every thought, demanding our worship ... that can create psychological problems for some people.

Yes, if you are not sure He loves you.

cloudyday2 · Jul 30, 2015

smaneck said:
Yes, if you are not sure He loves you.

Thanks.

Aidan K · Jul 30, 2015

smaneck said:
There is a Baha'i prayer called the Remover of Difficulties that some Baha'is will say 500 times as a dhikr. I haven't done this very often because it takes about an hour and a half. But when I have to drive all night (which I haven't done in the last fifteen years) I would sometimes say it to stay awake.

Susan, how to keep count?

Aidan K · Jul 30, 2015

smaneck said:
I had to stop fasting a few years ago when I developed Diabetes II and kidney stones.

Unfortunately I too am unable to fast due to medical reasons. At fast times I like to increase my time praying and spiritual reading

smaneck · Jul 30, 2015

Aidan K said:
Susan, how to keep count?

The old finger trick. Just do ninety five four times on your fingers then add another twenty. Keeping track is part of what keeps me awake.

cloudyday2 · Jul 30, 2015

smaneck said:
The old finger trick. Just do ninety five four times on your fingers then add another twenty. Keeping track is part of what keeps me awake.

I assume you have one hand on the steering wheel, so that leaves you 5 fingers. I'm trying to imagine how you do 95...

smaneck · Jul 30, 2015

cloudyday2 said:
I assume you have one hand on the steering wheel, so that leaves you 5 fingers. I'm trying to imagine how you do 95...

I can do it with both hands on the wheel, although only one hand is really necessary. There are a total of nineteen joints in the fingers of the hand, four on each finger and three on the thumb. Do it five times and you have ninety five. The other hand sort of keeps track of where you are.

Arthra · Jul 31, 2015

I've achieved "old age" being over the age of seventy I still recite of course the prayers but no longer fast.. but the fasting prayers can still be recited. No one is standing over us or regulating what we do...and that goes for fasting, praying or contributing... No Mullahs, Ministers or Priests.

cloudyday2 · Jul 31, 2015

Arthra said:
I've achieved "old age" being over the age of seventy I still recite of course the prayers but no longer fast.. but the fasting prayers can still be recited. No one is standing over us or regulating what we do...and that goes for fasting, praying or contributing... No Mullahs, Ministers or Priests.

Do you think there is somebody standing over a Muslim or a Christian cracking a whip to make them pray or fast? Of course not - right? Yet the Muslim and Christian members simply addressed my question instead of behaving defensively. I'm an atheist, so of course I have no use for your religion or anybody else's. If you are hoping for me to apologize for describing Baha'i as "regulated", don't hold your breath

EDIT: And I don't mean to upset you with my response. As I said in another thread "hate the religion and love the religious".

cloudyday2 · Jul 31, 2015

gordRedeemed said:
Islam would be tough for a person with OCD problems I reckon. I tried Islam twice. The first time my OCD was a bit worse and messing up a prayer would be brutal as I would have to start over or add another rakat (round). Same with doing the ablutions. The second time I tried Islam my OCD was pretty much defeated so I would just ignore most small errors and move on. But Islam does have quite a few rules per see when it comes to prayer and ablutions that might give a person with OCD some trouble for sure.

@gordRedeemed, I don't know if you read what @smaneck wrote. My paraphrase would be that scrupulosity is caused by the theology and only expressed through the practices. That sounds reasonable to me, but your post quoted above seems to suggest otherwise. Also you have personal experience with OCD, so I wondered what you think.

cloudyday2 · Jul 31, 2015

LOL, I haven't been to church for almost 5 years, but I still cross myself sometimes. I probably am more compulsive than most people.

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