Addressing Heretical Application of the Trinity Doctrine

he-man · Jul 27, 2015

jerry kelso said:
1. I don't believe I said Elohim was Greek. But when Elohim is used to show more than one person in the Godhead it is Greek to you. Show me where you think man can be "The Savior of the World" and "The Son of God" and forgive sins and be the mediator of man and God, and be worshipped by men and share his glory with God the father who will not share his glory with another if he was just merely a man. Jerry kelso

1 John 4:2 By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, (3) and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world.

com7fy8 · Jul 27, 2015

he-man said:
So you think the Holy Spirit and Christ are equal? Mat 12:32 And whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

I consider that this means the sins are not equal. It means that the person who speaks against the Holy Spirit has become more deeply ruined, so he or she can do this. But ones who are speaking against Jesus have not gotten that far.

Jesus is caring about how a person is becoming, by doing a sin; He is not only concerned about His "status" in comparison with the Holy Spirit's "status". But there are people who have a mindset and heart which is more concerned about status, than about how we really are or are not in real nature of love.

People can be forgiven for speaking against Jesus. But if they do not stop but keep on to also blaspheming the Holy Spirit, they have refused Jesus who suffered and died like He did, on Calvary, for us all. So, it is not meant that the Holy Spirit is superior, but that one moving past Jesus to also the Holy Spirit is refusing forgiveness.

Also - - the Holy Spirit does the real dirty work - - in us, of cleaning us out, getting rid of the nasty filth of sin in us. So, if ones do not appreciate this, this is worse than speaking against Jesus who is having a much nicer time on the throne, not doing the dirty work which the Holy Spirit is doing in people. The labor of the Holy Spirit in us is greater than the outward things which Jesus did on this earth. But, though They are specialized in what They do, this does not mean one Person is better than another. But if a person speaks against the Holy Spirit who does such dirty work, this can be worse than not appreciating what Jesus has done, which even on Calvary was more outwardly awful, but possibly not as awful as dealing with and removing sin from inside a person.

Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father only.
Proverbs 16:19 Better to be of a humble spirit with the lowly, Than to divide the spoil with the proud.

Well, ones suppose that having knowledge makes you superior to others. Ones can get quite puffy about how they know what others don't > 1 Corinthians 8:1-3. But I will offer > our Father is a Person of love, and Jesus is a Person of love; but each one specializes in what love knows and does. And one Person is not superior to the other, only because of what one Person does which the other doesn't. But the equality and oneness is in love.

But worldly people can give more praise and even more love to ones who know more. This is nothing new. What you know is not what can make you superior to someone else. How we are in love together with one another makes us equal, even though we have different functions in Jesus and different knowledge which can specialize us for all Jesus has for each of us to enjoy and do. Like this, the three Persons are equal, even though They have specialized functions with love purposes and knowledge.

Crowns&Laurels · Jul 27, 2015

When it's stated 'three persons' of the Trinity, I think the context is a bit different when it comes to the Spirit- the Spirit is not an incantation, in my opinion, of the Trinity meant to be worshiped. It's 'person' is not meant to be bow to, as it is rather a general autonomy.
In other words, in which direction do you bow to the Spirit? I mean that half humorously and in illustrating the issue. Christians are directed by all three persons to bow to Christ.

he-man · Jul 28, 2015

com7fy8 said:
I consider that this means the sins are not equal. It means that the person who speaks against the Holy Spirit has become more deeply ruined, so he or she can do this. But ones who are speaking against Jesus have not gotten that far..

What it means is that Christ and the Holy Spirit and the Father are NOT a Trinity. Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father only.

he-man · Jul 30, 2015

jerry kelso said:
. I don't believe I said Elohim was Greek. But when Elohim is used to show more than one person in the Godhead it is Greek to you. Jerry kelso

The masculine plural ending does not mean “gods” when referring to the true God of Israel

jerry kelso · Aug 2, 2015

he-man said:
The masculine plural ending does not mean “gods” when referring to the true God of Israel

he man,
I never said Elohim was always plural in every scripture because it is not. However, it is in scriptures to show that there are three members of the Godhead in one unity that cannot be broken.
You still have not answered to the fact that God the father cannot be Redeemer in reality or the fact that he shares his glory with the son as deity for the son is worshipped by men and he said he would not share his glory with another. You cannot reconcile this scriptures together with your interpretation. Tell me how do you reconcile the scripture that says God the father told the angels and men to worship him. Jerry Kelso

createdtoworship · Aug 2, 2015

he-man said:
The text, therefore, should be read: which from the beginning of the world had been hidden in God who created all things. [CLARKE]
1Co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God; 1Co 3:23 And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.
My advice for you would be Hosea 10:12 Sow for yourselves righteousness; Reap in mercy; Break up your fallow ground, For it is time to seek the LORD, Till He comes and rains righteousness on you.
Col 1:16 That in Christ all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities, all things have been created for him and on behalf of him. 17 He is in front of all things, and in him all things stand together. :18 And he is the head of the body, the assembly: who is a beginning of the firstborn from the dead; that among all he might be first.
by him — rather as Greek, “in Him” as the conditional element, and is a different fact from the present one [Alford]
Isa 40:28 Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting God,Jehovah, the Creator of the ends of the earth, fainteth not, neither is weary? there is no searching of his understanding.
Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Mat 1:16 And Jacob γεννάω Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was γεννάω Jesus, who is called Christ.
G1080 γεννάω - bear, beget, be born.
1 Peter 2:13 For it is God’s will that by doing good you should silence the ignorant talk of foolish people.
Isa 42:5 Thus saith God Jehovah, He that created the heavens, and stretched them out; He that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; He that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:

looks like you copied and pasted from some greek christian dictionary ,here, and /or a lexicon etc.

but there are no quotations, no link, and not citation.

I believe this is copywrite enfringement, and may be reported by people on this thread if they chose to.
(I have talked to you about this issue probably 6 times in the last 2 years, and you still seem not to care)

God says plainly in the scriptures

"thou shalt not steal"

he-man · Aug 3, 2015

jerry kelso said:
You still have not answered to the fact that God the father cannot be Redeemer in reality or the fact that he shares his glory with the son as deity for the son is worshipped by men and he said he would not share his glory with another. You cannot reconcile this scriptures together with your interpretation. Tell me how do you reconcile the scripture that says God the father told the angels and men to worship him. Jerry Kelso

Dear, dear, Jerry, you must first be able to understand scripture before you can interpret it.
Lk 24:25 Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures
Php 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that He which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
So, you who are troubled, can now you see that your scripture is a thing that will be in the future when Christ is given all things!
2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ
At that time the fire will burn up all his enemies and they will have to pay the justice--of destruction age-lasting--
Ps 97:3 A fire goeth before him, and burneth up his enemies round about.
7 Confounded be all they that serve graven images, that boast themselves of idols: worship him, all ye gods.
Rev 5:14 And the four living things said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.

he-man · Aug 3, 2015

gradyll said:
looks like you copied and pasted from some greek christian dictionary ,here, and /or a lexicon etc.but there are no quotations, no link, and not citation.God says plainly in the scriptures "thou shalt not steal"

He also says plainly you must first have your mind opened by Him. Picking out petty things is childness. and I have e-sword as a reference.
You must first be able to understand scripture before you can interpret it.
Lk 24:25 Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures
Php 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that He which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
So, you who are troubled, can now you see that your scripture is a thing that will be in the future when Christ is given all things!
2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ
At that time the fire will burn up all his enemies and they will have to pay the justice--of destruction age-lasting--
Ps 97:3 A fire goeth before him, and burneth up his enemies round about.
7 Confounded be all they that serve graven images, that boast themselves of idols: worship him, all ye gods.
Rev 5:14 And the four living things said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.

jerry kelso · Aug 5, 2015

he-man said:
Dear, dear, Jerry, you must first be able to understand scripture before you can interpret it.
Lk 24:25 Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures
Php 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that He which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
So, you who are troubled, can now you see that your scripture is a thing that will be in the future when Christ is given all things!
2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ
At that time the fire will burn up all his enemies and they will have to pay the justice--of destruction age-lasting--
Ps 97:3 A fire goeth before him, and burneth up his enemies round about.
7 Confounded be all they that serve graven images, that boast themselves of idols: worship him, all ye gods.
Rev 5:14 And the four living things said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.

he-man,
Dear, dear, Jerry? That sounds patronizing. LOL!
Listen he-man, you have said nothing to bolster your position and you have not addressed the father not sharing his glory with another and yet sharing it with "The Son of God" Jesus Christ.
Your scriptures have no scriptural basis and that is why you are spinning. You can share your greek knowledge and that is fine but you get into trouble because you cannot reconcile the scriptures correctly so they harmonize together.
As far as understanding scriptures I do and I wouldn't say that you don't know anything either, but you have tunnel vision and wrong hermeneutics on this point and probably many others. Good luck. Jerry Kelso

he-man · Aug 6, 2015

jerry kelso said:
As far as understanding scriptures I do and I wouldn't say that you don't know anything either, but you have tunnel vision and wrong hermeneutics on this point and probably many others. Good luck. Jerry Kelso

Poor, poor, misguided people like the eunuch.
Act 8:34 The eunuch asked Philip, “Tell me, please, who is the prophet talking about, himself or someone else?”
Jesus said:'I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to My God and your God'" (John 20:17). " He ascended in glory to the right hand of the Father in heaven!
Then Philip began with that very passage of Scripture and told him the good news about Jesus.

createdtoworship · Aug 8, 2015

he-man said:
He also says plainly you must first have your mind opened by Him. Picking out petty things is childness. and I have e-sword as a reference.
You must first be able to understand scripture before you can interpret it.
Lk 24:25 Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures
Php 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that He which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
So, you who are troubled, can now you see that your scripture is a thing that will be in the future when Christ is given all things!
2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ
At that time the fire will burn up all his enemies and they will have to pay the justice--of destruction age-lasting--
Ps 97:3 A fire goeth before him, and burneth up his enemies round about.
7 Confounded be all they that serve graven images, that boast themselves of idols: worship him, all ye gods.
Rev 5:14 And the four living things said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.

Esword is a database of books by individual authors, thats like claiming amazon as a reference.

that does not really work out logically for your arguments.

he-man · Aug 8, 2015

gradyll said:
Esword is a database of books by individual authors, thats like claiming amazon as a reference. that does not really work out logically for your arguments.

This is the year 2015 A.D. not 2015 B.C. so pay attention: He sat down on his own right hand? Then why did Christ say, "..but to sit on the right hand or the left hand* is NOT mine to give?
Did God forget to tell Jesus the HOUR? Did the translators try to cover up Mat 24:36, when they chose not to include "NOR THE SON"?
Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, *neither the Son*, but the Father.
Mat 24:36 περι δε τηϲ ημεραϲ εκεινηϲ και ωραϲ ουδειϲ οιδε ουδε οι αγγελοι τω ουρανων ουδε ο υιοϲ ει μη ο πατηρ μονοϲ.
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, not the Son, if not the Father only. [Codex Sinaiticus]
Mat 24:36 περι δε της ημερας εκεινης και ωρας ουδεις οιδεν ουδε οι αγγελοι των ουρανων ουδε ο υιος ει μη ο πατηρ μονος [GNT]
36 But of that day and hour no one knows, neither the angels of the heavens, nor the Son, but the Father only.

Or try this: Jn 1:1 In the beginning was that word, and that word was with god: and god was that word
THE NEW TESTAMENT W TYNDALE Bible

Along with Codex Vaticanus, Codex Sinaiticus is one of the most valuable manuscripts for establishing the original text of the Greek New Testament, as well as the Septuagint. It is the only uncial manuscript with the complete text of the New Testament, and the only ancient manuscript of the New Testament written in four columns per page which has survived to the present day.
The work was written in scripta continua with neither breathings nor poly tonic accents. Occasional points and few ligatures are used, though nomina sacra with over lines are employed throughout. For most of the New Testament, Codex Sinaiticus is in general agreement with Codex Vaticanus and Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus, attesting the Alexandrian text-type.
Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Bezae are the only Greek manuscripts with textual variant ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ἐστίν (in him is life) instead of ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ᾓν (in him was life). This variant is supported by Vetus Latina and some Sahidic manuscripts
http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Codex_Sinaiticus
You can also go here for over 100 Bible translations if you do not like e-sword or Tyndale, or the originals
https://www.biblegateway.com/
http://www.csntm.org/manuscript
http://www.laparola.net/greco/

jerry kelso · Aug 8, 2015

he-man said:
Poor, poor, misguided people like the eunuch.
Act 8:34 The eunuch asked Philip, “Tell me, please, who is the prophet talking about, himself or someone else?”
Jesus said:'I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to My God and your God'" (John 20:17). " He ascended in glory to the right hand of the Father in heaven!
Then Philip began with that very passage of Scripture and told him the good news about Jesus.

he-man,
1. You cannot prove the overall context and point of Jesus being deity, equal with the Father because God the Father said he would not share his glory with another and yet he told the angels of God to worship him. Men worship him and every knee shall bow before him.
God won't share his glory with man for he is the creator and we are the created. He will not share it with the angels for they are created as well. He can only share it with deity. This shows that the context of the statement is talking of someone who is not deity. Jesus is deity and this is the only way to reconcile these scriptures together so that they harmonize and not contradict.

2. You keep trying to use a scripture here and there to prove your point and cannot except within itself and no other context. Jesus called him the Father and his God and this is true because he is the son of God and he is his father. This is the office and not because Jesus is just human only theory. The father called his son God but, of course, you had to give the wrong greek translation on that scripture to try and prove your point. It doesn't work in reconciling all the scriptures on this subject.
Give up! Your redundancy shows your motive to prove a point that you cannot and have not and will not be able to prove. Jerry Kelso

he-man · Aug 9, 2015

jerry kelso said:
You cannot prove the overall context and point of Jesus being deity, equal with the Father because God the Father said he would not share his glory with another and yet he told the angels of God to worship him. Men worship him and every knee shall bow before him.

That is the FUTURE tense, not present!

jerry kelso said:
The father called his son God but, of course, you had to give the wrong greek translation on that scripture to try and prove your point.. Jerry Kelso

God, who is the Father of us, only had immortality until He resurrected Jesus, who now waits obediently on the right hand of God. That is why it says: Joh 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. and...
Jesus died and was dead for three days and he gave up the breath of life (Spirit) Jn 19:30
Heb 9:16 For where there is a testament, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. (17) For a testament is in force after men are dead, since it has no power at all while the testator lives.
He sat down on his own right hand? Then why did Christ say, "..but to sit on the right hand or the left hand* is NOT mine to give?
Did God forget to tell Jesus the HOUR? Did the translators try to cover up Mat 24:36, when they chose not to include "NOR THE SON"?
Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, *neither the Son*, but the Father.
Mat 24:36 περι δε τηϲ ημεραϲ εκεινηϲ και ωραϲ ουδειϲ οιδε ουδε οι αγγελοι τω ουρανων ουδε ο υιοϲ ει μη ο πατηρ μονοϲ.
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, not the Son, if not the Father only. [Codex Sinaiticus]
Mat 24:36 περι δε της ημερας εκεινης και ωρας ουδεις οιδεν ουδε οι αγγελοι των ουρανων ουδε ο υιος ει μη ο πατηρ μονος [GNT]
36 But of that day and hour no one knows, neither the angels of the heavens, nor the Son, but the Father only.

Or try this: Jn 1:1 In the beginning was that word, and that word was with god: and god was that word
THE NEW TESTAMENT W TYNDALE Bible

Along with Codex Vaticanus, Codex Sinaiticus is one of the most valuable manuscripts for establishing the original text of the Greek New Testament, as well as the Septuagint. It is the only uncial manuscript with the complete text of the New Testament, and the only ancient manuscript of the New Testament written in four columns per page which has survived to the present day.
The work was written in scripta continua with neither breathings nor poly tonic accents. Occasional points and few ligatures are used, though nomina sacra with over lines are employed throughout. For most of the New Testament, Codex Sinaiticus is in general agreement with Codex Vaticanus and Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus, attesting the Alexandrian text-type.
Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Bezae are the only Greek manuscripts with textual variant ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ἐστίν (in him is life) instead of ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ᾓν (in him was life). This variant is supported by Vetus Latina and some Sahidic manuscripts
http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Codex_Sinaiticus
You can also go here for over 100 Bible translations if you do not like e-sword or Tyndale, or the originals
https://www.biblegateway.com/
http://www.csntm.org/manuscript
http://www.laparola.net/greco/

createdtoworship · Aug 9, 2015

he-man said:
This is the year 2015 A.D. not 2015 B.C. so pay attention: He sat down on his own right hand? Then why did Christ say, "..but to sit on the right hand or the left hand* is NOT mine to give?
Did God forget to tell Jesus the HOUR? Did the translators try to cover up Mat 24:36, when they chose not to include "NOR THE SON"?
Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, *neither the Son*, but the Father.
Mat 24:36 περι δε τηϲ ημεραϲ εκεινηϲ και ωραϲ ουδειϲ οιδε ουδε οι αγγελοι τω ουρανων ουδε ο υιοϲ ει μη ο πατηρ μονοϲ.
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, not the Son, if not the Father only. [Codex Sinaiticus]
Mat 24:36 περι δε της ημερας εκεινης και ωρας ουδεις οιδεν ουδε οι αγγελοι των ουρανων ουδε ο υιος ει μη ο πατηρ μονος [GNT]
36 But of that day and hour no one knows, neither the angels of the heavens, nor the Son, but the Father only.

Or try this: Jn 1:1 In the beginning was that word, and that word was with god: and god was that word
THE NEW TESTAMENT W TYNDALE Bible

Along with Codex Vaticanus, Codex Sinaiticus is one of the most valuable manuscripts for establishing the original text of the Greek New Testament, as well as the Septuagint. It is the only uncial manuscript with the complete text of the New Testament, and the only ancient manuscript of the New Testament written in four columns per page which has survived to the present day.
The work was written in scripta continua with neither breathings nor poly tonic accents. Occasional points and few ligatures are used, though nomina sacra with over lines are employed throughout. For most of the New Testament, Codex Sinaiticus is in general agreement with Codex Vaticanus and Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus, attesting the Alexandrian text-type.
Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Bezae are the only Greek manuscripts with textual variant ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ἐστίν (in him is life) instead of ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ᾓν (in him was life). This variant is supported by Vetus Latina and some Sahidic manuscripts
http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Codex_Sinaiticus
You can also go here for over 100 Bible translations if you do not like e-sword or Tyndale, or the originals
https://www.biblegateway.com/
http://www.csntm.org/manuscript
http://www.laparola.net/greco/

well thats better, however, elipses are common courtesee and I believe are required forum rules for quoting, to avoid copywrite infringement, but offering up links for where you got the info is a start.

please attempt to at least look into the matter, this adds to one's credibility as well.

thanks

he-man · Aug 10, 2015

gradyll said:
well thats better, however, elipses are common courtesee and I believe are required forum rules for quoting, to avoid copywrite infringement, but offering up links for where you got the info is a start. please attempt to at least look into the matter, this adds to one's credibility as well.
thanks

Your intention is to interrupt what I have posted and attack it rather than address the facts I have posted!!!
If you know your Bible you can look them up yourself! http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Codex_Sinaiticus
You can also go here for over 100 Bible translations if you do not like e-sword or Tyndale, or the originals
https://www.biblegateway.com/
http://www.csntm.org/manuscript
http://www.laparola.net/greco/

Proverbs 16:18 Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall.
Psalm 119:165 Great peace have those who love Your law, And nothing causes them to stumble.

Then why did Christ say, "..but to sit on the right hand or the left hand* is NOT mine to give?
Did God forget to tell Jesus the HOUR? Did the translators try to cover up Mat 24:36, when they chose not to include "NOR THE SON"?
Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, *neither the Son*, but the Father.
Mat 24:36 περι δε τηϲ ημεραϲ εκεινηϲ και ωραϲ ουδειϲ οιδε ουδε οι αγγελοι τω ουρανων ουδε ο υιοϲ ει μη ο πατηρ μονοϲ.
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, not the Son, if not the Father only. [Codex Sinaiticus]
Mat 24:36 περι δε της ημερας εκεινης και ωρας ουδεις οιδεν ουδε οι αγγελοι των ουρανων ουδε ο υιος ει μη ο πατηρ μονος [GNT]
36 But of that day and hour no one knows, neither the angels of the heavens, nor the Son, but the Father only.

Or try this: Jn 1:1 In the beginning was that word, and that word was with god: and god was that word
THE NEW TESTAMENT W TYNDALE Bible

Along with Codex Vaticanus, Codex Sinaiticus is one of the most valuable manuscripts for establishing the original text of the Greek New Testament, as well as the Septuagint. It is the only uncial manuscript with the complete text of the New Testament, and the only ancient manuscript of the New Testament written in four columns per page which has survived to the present day.
The work was written in scripta continua with neither breathings nor poly tonic accents. Occasional points and few ligatures are used, though nomina sacra with over lines are employed throughout. For most of the New Testament, Codex Sinaiticus is in general agreement with Codex Vaticanus and Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus, attesting the Alexandrian text-type.
Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Bezae are the only Greek manuscripts with textual variant ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ἐστίν (in him is life) instead of ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ᾓν (in him was life). This variant is supported by Vetus Latina and some Sahidic manuscripts
The text, therefore, should be read: which from the beginning of the world had been hidden in God who created all things. [CLARKE]
1Co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God; 1Co 3:23 And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.
My advice for you would be Hosea 10:12 Sow for yourselves righteousness; Reap in mercy; Break up your fallow ground, For it is time to seek the LORD, Till He comes and rains righteousness on you.
Col 1:16 That in Christ all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities, all things have been created for him and on behalf of him. 17 He is in front of all things, and in him all things stand together. :18 And he is the head of the body, the assembly: who is a beginning of the firstborn from the dead; that among all he might be first.
by him — rather as Greek, “in Him” as the conditional element, and is a different fact from the present one [Alford]
Isa 40:28 Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting God,Jehovah, the Creator of the ends of the earth, fainteth not, neither is weary? there is no searching of his understanding.
Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Mat 1:16 And Jacob γεννάω Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was γεννάω Jesus, who is called Christ.
G1080 γεννάω - bear, beget, be born.
1 Peter 2:13 For it is God’s will that by doing good you should silence the ignorant talk of foolish people.
Isa 42:5 Thus saith God Jehovah, He that created the heavens, and stretched them out; He that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; He that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Codex_Sinaiticus
You can also go here for over 100 Bible translations if you do not like e-sword or Tyndale, or the originals
https://www.biblegateway.com/
http://www.csntm.org/manuscript
http://www.laparola.net/greco/

he-man · Aug 11, 2015

gradyll said:
Esword is a database of books by individual authors, thats like claiming amazon as a reference.
that does not really work out logically for your arguments.

Ps 121:1 I lift up my eyes to the mountains- where does my help come from? My help comes from Jehovah, the Maker of heaven and earth.
H3068 יהוה yehôvâh From H1961; (the) self Existent or eternal; Jehovah, Jewish national name of God
Psa 145:20 Jehovah preserveth all them that love Him: but all the wicked He will destroy.
Heb 13:7 Remember them which lead you, who have spoken unto you the word of God: whose faith follow, considering the end of their behavior.
The word of God (ton logon tou theou). The preaching of these early disciples, apostles, and prophets.
Note: The same number as John 1:1 word,G3056[RWP] [KJV with Strong's Numbers]

he-man · Aug 12, 2015

he-man said:
Your intention is to interrupt what I have posted and attack it rather than address the facts I have posted!!!
If you know your Bible you can look them up yourself! http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Codex_Sinaiticus
You can also go here for over 100 Bible translations if you do not like e-sword or Tyndale, or the originals
https://www.biblegateway.com/
http://www.csntm.org/manuscript
http://www.laparola.net/greco/

Proverbs 16:18 Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall.
Psalm 119:165 Great peace have those who love Your law, And nothing causes them to stumble.

Then why did Christ say, "..but to sit on the right hand or the left hand* is NOT mine to give?
Did God forget to tell Jesus the HOUR? Did the translators try to cover up Mat 24:36, when they chose not to include "NOR THE SON"?
Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, *neither the Son*, but the Father.
Mat 24:36 περι δε τηϲ ημεραϲ εκεινηϲ και ωραϲ ουδειϲ οιδε ουδε οι αγγελοι τω ουρανων ουδε ο υιοϲ ει μη ο πατηρ μονοϲ.
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, not the Son, if not the Father only. [Codex Sinaiticus]
Mat 24:36 περι δε της ημερας εκεινης και ωρας ουδεις οιδεν ουδε οι αγγελοι των ουρανων ουδε ο υιος ει μη ο πατηρ μονος [GNT]
36 But of that day and hour no one knows, neither the angels of the heavens, nor the Son, but the Father only.

Or try this: Jn 1:1 In the beginning was that word, and that word was with god: and god was that word
THE NEW TESTAMENT W TYNDALE Bible

Along with Codex Vaticanus, Codex Sinaiticus is one of the most valuable manuscripts for establishing the original text of the Greek New Testament, as well as the Septuagint. It is the only uncial manuscript with the complete text of the New Testament, and the only ancient manuscript of the New Testament written in four columns per page which has survived to the present day.
The work was written in scripta continua with neither breathings nor poly tonic accents. Occasional points and few ligatures are used, though nomina sacra with over lines are employed throughout. For most of the New Testament, Codex Sinaiticus is in general agreement with Codex Vaticanus and Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus, attesting the Alexandrian text-type.
Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Bezae are the only Greek manuscripts with textual variant ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ἐστίν (in him is life) instead of ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ᾓν (in him was life). This variant is supported by Vetus Latina and some Sahidic manuscripts
The text, therefore, should be read: which from the beginning of the world had been hidden in God who created all things. [CLARKE]
1Co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God; 1Co 3:23 And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.
My advice for you would be Hosea 10:12 Sow for yourselves righteousness; Reap in mercy; Break up your fallow ground, For it is time to seek the LORD, Till He comes and rains righteousness on you.
Col 1:16 That in Christ all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities, all things have been created for him and on behalf of him. 17 He is in front of all things, and in him all things stand together. :18 And he is the head of the body, the assembly: who is a beginning of the firstborn from the dead; that among all he might be first.
by him — rather as Greek, “in Him” as the conditional element, and is a different fact from the present one [Alford]
Isa 40:28 Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting God,Jehovah, the Creator of the ends of the earth, fainteth not, neither is weary? there is no searching of his understanding.
Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Mat 1:16 And Jacob γεννάω Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was γεννάω Jesus, who is called Christ.
G1080 γεννάω - bear, beget, be born.
1 Peter 2:13 For it is God’s will that by doing good you should silence the ignorant talk of foolish people.
Isa 42:5 Thus saith God Jehovah, He that created the heavens, and stretched them out; He that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; He that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Codex_Sinaiticus
You can also go here for over 100 Bible translations if you do not like e-sword or Tyndale, or the originals
https://www.biblegateway.com/
http://www.csntm.org/manuscript
http://www.laparola.net/greco/

Kelso and Grady are both out of answers and cannot dispute the word of God. Why? Ecclesiastes 8:14 There is a vanity which occurs on earth, that there are just men to whom it happens according to the work of the wicked; again, there are wicked men to whom it happens according to the work of the righteous. I said that this also is vanity 17 Then I beheld all the work of God, that a man cannot find out the work that is done under the sun: because though a man labour to seek it out, yet he shall not find it; yea further; though a wise man think to know it, yet shall he not be able to find it. .
New King James Version
Proverbs 16:18 Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall.
Psalm 119:165 Great peace have those who love Your law, And nothing causes them to stumble.

Then why did Christ say, "..but to sit on the right hand or the left hand* is NOT mine to give?
Did God forget to tell Jesus the HOUR? Did the translators try to cover up Mat 24:36, when they chose not to include "NOR THE SON"?
Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, *neither the Son*, but the Father.
Mat 24:36 περι δε τηϲ ημεραϲ εκεινηϲ και ωραϲ ουδειϲ οιδε ουδε οι αγγελοι τω ουρανων ουδε ο υιοϲ ει μη ο πατηρ μονοϲ.
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, not the Son, if not the Father only. [Codex Sinaiticus]
Mat 24:36 περι δε της ημερας εκεινης και ωρας ουδεις οιδεν ουδε οι αγγελοι των ουρανων ουδε ο υιος ει μη ο πατηρ μονος [GNT]
36 But of that day and hour no one knows, neither the angels of the heavens, nor the Son, but the Father only.

Or try this: Jn 1:1 In the beginning was that word, and that word was with god: and god was that word
THE NEW TESTAMENT W TYNDALE Bible

Along with Codex Vaticanus, Codex Sinaiticus is one of the most valuable manuscripts for establishing the original text of the Greek New Testament, as well as the Septuagint. It is the only uncial manuscript with the complete text of the New Testament, and the only ancient manuscript of the New Testament written in four columns per page which has survived to the present day.
The work was written in scripta continua with neither breathings nor poly tonic accents. Occasional points and few ligatures are used, though nomina sacra with over lines are employed throughout. For most of the New Testament, Codex Sinaiticus is in general agreement with Codex Vaticanus and Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus, attesting the Alexandrian text-type.
Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Bezae are the only Greek manuscripts with textual variant ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ἐστίν (in him is life) instead of ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ᾓν (in him was life). This variant is supported by Vetus Latina and some Sahidic manuscripts
The text, therefore, should be read: which from the beginning of the world had been hidden in God who created all things. [CLARKE]
1Co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God; 1Co 3:23 And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.
My advice for you would be Hosea 10:12 Sow for yourselves righteousness; Reap in mercy; Break up your fallow ground, For it is time to seek the LORD, Till He comes and rains righteousness on you.
Col 1:16 That in Christ all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities, all things have been created for him and on behalf of him. 17 He is in front of all things, and in him all things stand together. :18 And he is the head of the body, the assembly: who is a beginning of the firstborn from the dead; that among all he might be first.
by him — rather as Greek, “in Him” as the conditional element, and is a different fact from the present one [Alford]
Isa 40:28 Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting God,Jehovah, the Creator of the ends of the earth, fainteth not, neither is weary? there is no searching of his understanding.
Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Mat 1:16 And Jacob γεννάω Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was γεννάω Jesus, who is called Christ.
G1080 γεννάω - bear, beget, be born.
1 Peter 2:13 For it is God’s will that by doing good you should silence the ignorant talk of foolish people.
Isa 42:5 Thus saith God Jehovah, He that created the heavens, and stretched them out; He that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; He that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Codex_Sinaiticus
You can also go here for over 100 Bible translations if you do not like e-sword or Tyndale, or the originals
https://www.biblegateway.com/
http://www.csntm.org/manuscript
http://www.laparola.net/greco/

he-man · Aug 13, 2015

he-man said:
Your intention is to interrupt what I have posted and attack it rather than address the facts I have posted!!!
If you know your Bible you can look them up yourself! http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Codex_Sinaiticus
You can also go here for over 100 Bible translations if you do not like e-sword or Tyndale, or the originals
https://www.biblegateway.com/
http://www.csntm.org/manuscript
http://www.laparola.net/greco/

Proverbs 16:18 Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall.
Psalm 119:165 Great peace have those who love Your law, And nothing causes them to stumble.

Then why did Christ say, "..but to sit on the right hand or the left hand* is NOT mine to give?
Did God forget to tell Jesus the HOUR? Did the translators try to cover up Mat 24:36, when they chose not to include "NOR THE SON"?
Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, *neither the Son*, but the Father.
Mat 24:36 περι δε τηϲ ημεραϲ εκεινηϲ και ωραϲ ουδειϲ οιδε ουδε οι αγγελοι τω ουρανων ουδε ο υιοϲ ει μη ο πατηρ μονοϲ.
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, not the Son, if not the Father only. [Codex Sinaiticus]
Mat 24:36 περι δε της ημερας εκεινης και ωρας ουδεις οιδεν ουδε οι αγγελοι των ουρανων ουδε ο υιος ει μη ο πατηρ μονος [GNT]
36 But of that day and hour no one knows, neither the angels of the heavens, nor the Son, but the Father only.

Or try this: Jn 1:1 In the beginning was that word, and that word was with god: and god was that word
THE NEW TESTAMENT W TYNDALE Bible

Along with Codex Vaticanus, Codex Sinaiticus is one of the most valuable manuscripts for establishing the original text of the Greek New Testament, as well as the Septuagint. It is the only uncial manuscript with the complete text of the New Testament, and the only ancient manuscript of the New Testament written in four columns per page which has survived to the present day.
The work was written in scripta continua with neither breathings nor poly tonic accents. Occasional points and few ligatures are used, though nomina sacra with over lines are employed throughout. For most of the New Testament, Codex Sinaiticus is in general agreement with Codex Vaticanus and Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus, attesting the Alexandrian text-type.
Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Bezae are the only Greek manuscripts with textual variant ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ἐστίν (in him is life) instead of ἐν αὐτῷ ζωὴ ᾓν (in him was life). This variant is supported by Vetus Latina and some Sahidic manuscripts
The text, therefore, should be read: which from the beginning of the world had been hidden in God who created all things. [CLARKE]
1Co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God; 1Co 3:23 And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.
My advice for you would be Hosea 10:12 Sow for yourselves righteousness; Reap in mercy; Break up your fallow ground, For it is time to seek the LORD, Till He comes and rains righteousness on you.
Col 1:16 That in Christ all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities, all things have been created for him and on behalf of him. 17 He is in front of all things, and in him all things stand together. :18 And he is the head of the body, the assembly: who is a beginning of the firstborn from the dead; that among all he might be first.
by him — rather as Greek, “in Him” as the conditional element, and is a different fact from the present one [Alford]
Isa 40:28 Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting God,Jehovah, the Creator of the ends of the earth, fainteth not, neither is weary? there is no searching of his understanding.
Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Mat 1:16 And Jacob γεννάω Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was γεννάω Jesus, who is called Christ.
G1080 γεννάω - bear, beget, be born.
1 Peter 2:13 For it is God’s will that by doing good you should silence the ignorant talk of foolish people.
Isa 42:5 Thus saith God Jehovah, He that created the heavens, and stretched them out; He that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; He that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Codex_Sinaiticus
You can also go here for over 100 Bible translations if you do not like e-sword or Tyndale, or the originals
https://www.biblegateway.com/
http://www.csntm.org/manuscript
http://www.laparola.net/greco/

Act 7:50 Hath not my hand made all these things? New King James Version

Addressing Heretical Application of the Trinity Doctrine

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