Discussion The WONDERFUL gift and mystery of Tongues ... a spiritual language

Alithis said:

complete and utter assumption .. we were not there to know that .. lets keep it honest

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To keep consistently with his own teaching, he would have made sure that there was an interpreter, or that he interpreted himself, like Smith Wigglesworth used to do to great effect. Actually it was when Wigglesworth received tongues that his ministry took off and became really powerful. He adamantly believed in it and used it to its fullest potential, and his powerful ministry of healing and miracles has never been equalled!

Alithis said:

umm yes .. and truth must also be believed to be received . the truth is "and they will speak with new tongues " that's the scripture and its TRUE

it is by faith and belief the promises are received .. not by doubt and unbelief

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I think our brother has a Bible with some pages of 1 Corinthians torn out of it, especially the pages containing chapter 14!

Alithis said:

yep .. but was simply making the point we cannot say paul did not speak in tongues in a public meeting ..it may have been from doing so that he realized in that setting it was not beneficial to the hearer ... unless interpreted . ... but just keeping it honest - we don't know and it makes no difference to the truth of this gift and its amazing use and part in a holy Spirit filled life .
i would that every one spoke in tongues as the holy Spirit gives utterance and had ALL the giftings with which to build one another up in the Spirit .

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Agreed.

ron4shua said:

Where did you read that in my post , my brother ? I'd be the first to say " miracles " AND
everything recorded in Acts happens today , and will continue into the long distant future .

As for " waste waist " , I thought I had hit spell check . Sorry if it caused you dismay , sorry .
Every once in a while I need a stiff double dose of humility , thank you .

Hallelu-YAH .

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I will need to ask you to forgive my rather whimisical remark!

Righttruth said:

But he never spoke an unknown tongue in a church. It is not my business to question what you are doing to my remarks privately! I hope chocolate helped you to regain composure!

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Paul never said that he did (or chose) not to speak in tongues during the congregational meeting, in fact he said that he wanted all to speak in tongues during the congregational meetings; with the proviso that each meeting contains three tongues and interpretations along with three prophecies.

What he did say was that five cognitive words that can instruct and build up others has more value than 10,000 words that were being directed to the Father in praise through a non-cognitive utterance. He used this line of thought to build his case that we are not permitted to allow the widespread use of uninterpreted tongues within our meetings, where, even though this type of corporate praise can be wonderful, particularly within a smaller group of Believers, it has no place within the main meetings as it not only lacks the instructive value of prophecy (or teaching etc) but that it can upset the unsaved or cessationist visitor.

When we pray in the Spirit our words of praise are directed to the Father whereas prophecy is directed to the congregation which can help to build up and strengthen the Believer/congregation. With tongues, even with the subsequent interpretation/articulation, this can only provide 'edification' in that we are able to gain an understanding of what someone has said to the Father.

As for Paul, it would be interesting to be in a meeting where he was speaking words of praise to the Father in the Spirit and I would imagine that his ability to listen to the leading of the Spirit could possibly reveal some amazing insights into the wonders of God.

Righttruth said:

Paul never said the gift of tongue is wonderful!

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Why would Paul ever say that praying in the Spirit is anything but absolutely wonderful?

Boidae said:

I have been desiring the prayer language for these past couple weeks and have asked God for it and believe that it was given to, but still no prayer language.

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As Jiminpa mentioned, it does seem that we can be our worst enemy where even John Piper (link) struggles in this regard, which can be seen in the Youtube clip at the 4.20 & 5.45 min mark. Undoubtedly Piper's strong Calvinist worldview has him in a bit of a bind and in spite of Piper's strong Charismatic inclinations, the later part of the video shows that he holds to a few misunderstandings.

When I was first prayed for in an FGBMFI meeting with maybe a dozen others, it still took me about another four hours to pray in tongues while I was sitting in a car by myself. Maybe my inability to open up in tongues was a result of my supine personality where the quieter environment was more suited to my liking.

Oscarr said:

Email me on paul90@slingshot.co.nz and I will send you my book "Tongues Made Easy". This has been very successful in bringing people through to being able to speak in tongues. I recently sent 20 copies to a pastor in Kenya and he reported a revival!

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While I have never received your book, you did give me directions in a PM on what to do.

I will just keep pressing on. Thanks though.

Edit: I also do not want my wife to see me receive a book from someone on the forums and I certainly cannot lie to her about where I got it. She already thinks that I receive to much "advice" from Christian forums and that I need to stay away from them and concentrate on my walk with God without outsiders help.

Boidae said:

While I have never received your book, you did give me directions in a PM on what to do.

I will just keep pressing on. Thanks though.

Edit: I also do not want my wife to see me receive a book from someone on the forums and I certainly cannot lie to her about where I got it. She already thinks that I receive to much "advice" from Christian forums and that I need to stay away from them and concentrate on my walk with God without outsiders help.

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Okay, the forum I will grant is something that can certainly take up a bit of time, but as for limiting advice from others, this is something that we really cannot do nor should we ever want to; though we certainly need to be careful that we consider everything that we hear.

Biblicist2 said:

Okay, the forum I will grant is something that can certainly take up a bit of time, but as for limiting advice from others, this is something that we really cannot do nor should we ever want to; though we certainly need to be careful that we consider everything that we hear.

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What I meant was, advice from people on a forum. She is fine with advice from our church or our friends, just not people from a forum.

Boidae said:

What I meant was, advice from people on a forum. She is fine with advice from our church or our friends, just not people from a forum.

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I suppose when it comes to any public forum that "advice" is probably not such a strong point with this type of media, but a forum such as this can certainly be thought provoking where we can take something on board for consideration at a later date.

For instance, as an Australian I would be inclined to say that "real men don't play soccer", which is hardly a comment that requires any form of emphatic agreement or disagreement but it can be an interesting statement that might help to understand how others think.

Having now said this, I feel that soccer should be an option in our junior level schools as it could give those mothers who want to keep their children wrapped in cotton wool where they keep them away from sports with a viable alternative.

Once these kids grow up they can then decide if they want to play sport or maybe stick with soccer.

Oscarr said:

Yep, it did, and the cat kept well out of my way!!

You are dead right. He never spoke in tongues publicly and he taught against public tongues unless they were interpreted. But privately, he spoke in tongues more than all the rest of them put together! So, as much as he opposed public tongues, he enthusiastically endorsed private tongues.

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No, he said conclusively to desire better gifts.

Alithis said:

complete and utter assumption .. we were not there to know that .. lets keep it honest

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I am honest and frank.

Alithis said:

umm yes .. and truth must also be believed to be received . the truth is "and they will speak with new tongues " that's the scripture and its TRUE

it is by faith and belief the promises are received .. not by doubt and unbelief

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Yes, new tongues indicates new known foreign languages not known to person speaking as it happened during Pentecost.

Biblicist2 said:

Why would Paul ever say that praying in the Spirit is anything but absolutely wonderful?

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Praying with the Spirit need not be with unknown tongue.

Alithis said:

or your really scraping an already empty barrel now bro lol .. I said the gift is wonderful.. everything that comes forth from the lord God is wonderful i never said paul said it .. but he certainly displays in his words that God and everything to do with God is wonderful

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Why is that Paul says to desire better gifts if everything is wonderful? Finally, he says love is the best which happens to be the fruit of the Spirit, not the gift!