Why should a Christian be against Gay 'marriage'?
- Thread starter Root of Jesse
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Take a look at all the marriages in scripture and count the ones that meet the standard of Jesus and the Church, or for that matter even reach the standard of Ephesians 5:25.
Jesus asserted definitively that men's hearts are hardened against their wives, but that it wasn't so in the beginning. In the beginning, Adam loved Eve. An instantaneous effect of his sin is that his heart was hardened against Eve--and that is displayed by how quickly Adam threw his wife under the bus when God confronted him. Eve's curse was that she would continue to desire a husband whose heart had been hardened against her.
It is not in the nature of the flesh for a man to love his wife, and it is not common in the world that a man does.
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As a pastor has said, "If you send your children to Roman schools, don't be surprised if they turn out to be Romans."
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Jan Volkes
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No sadly there are no texts written by Josephus or Roman writers, Josephus mentions James the brother of the Christ, but it would seem the "Christ" was not noteworthy enough to get a mention of his own, perhaps miracles and raising the dead were quite common place then, who knows?
You and your fellow Christians believing something is one thing, when they need to make things up in an attempt to justify those beliefs that's quite another thing, faith never seems to be enough for believers does it?
BTW. you do know that you can go into a Wikipedia page and edit it, you can make up and write what you like.
Even if their was overwhelming evidence that Jesus actually existed and lived that still would not tell us that he performed miracles and was the son of a supernatural god, every word that Jesus is supposed to have said in the N/T is hearsay, memories or stories told to the writers and written at the earliest 50 years after Jesus died, even knowing this Christians hang on every word that Jesus was supposed to have said.
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This is the second time I've seen you claim this. I'm curious to know what the other legal ways are?
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Jan Volkes
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How about teaching kids that "gay is normal"? if it wasn't normal why are there so many "Gays" in the world?
1/4 of the human population are "Gay" that's 25% of males and 22% of women.
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Professional historians do not doubt that there was a historical Jesus. They must accept it based on their own tools and techniques. For instance, you yourself point out "...stories told to the writers and written at the earliest 50 years after Jesus died..."
Do you not realize how few ancient figures have any more than a single document mentioning them even a hundred years after they died? If professional historians discounted the evidence they have for a historical Jesus, by the same measure they would have to discount virtually every ancient figure in history. Nobody would be left except a few Roman emperors (and a surprising number of them would also be discarded). Ancient historians would put themselves out of a job if they discounted Jesus based on the evidence of His existence.
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bhsmte
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Agree, the vast majority of NT historians agree Jesus was likely a real historical figure and at this point, I would tend to agree with them.
In the recent past though, there have been some pretty compelling arguments against Jesus being a real historical figure that are starting to gain a little bit of steam, with more historians, but still a small minority.
Let's face it as well, it has been quite difficult, to be a historian that is critical of the bible in general and those arguments are typically rejected out of hand by the majority. The vast majority of those doing this critique, are Christians themselves, which clearly would lead to a tad bit of bias, in how the scriptures are held up to historical scrutiny.
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But people didn't used to talk about it. And lot's of homosexuals used to repress and marry someone of the opposite sex just to fit in. Can't you see it was better when they lived a life of shame, hiding and misery and we could all pretend they didn't exist?
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See, if they just had the common decency to stay in the closet, pretend to be straight, and get an opposite sex partner and pump out 2.4 kids, everything would be fine, and we'd have none of the current upset. Just like Rosa Parks should have swallowed her pride and gone to the back of the bus. It would have been better for everyone.
But don't make the mistake of thinking it's all "comfy cosy", because one time Potsy, Ralph and I lost our money to card sharps and my dad Tom Bosley had to get it back!
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Are you simple? You do know that referring to 'James the son of Jesus' is also a reference to Jesus?
And you are simply wrong. Read Book 18 Chapter 3 of The Antiquities of the Jews by Josephus, it refers to Jesus and his crucifixion.
I don't see the point in debating any more, you seem determined to carry on in your delusion. For someone who supposedly likes 'evidence' you seem to have a gift in ignoring it and simply not reading what I am putting forward. I've given you at least a days reading to go through which refers to Jesus and you obviously haven't even looked at it, you've simply googled some retort and come back with the first response you got. You obviously have little if any knowledge of Christianity or even atheist apologetics to even attempt this absurd argument that Jesus never existed. I'm afraid you're bringing a knife to a gun fight.
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Jan Volkes
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James was not the son of Jesus he was the brother of Jesus and yes Josephus made referenced to him but not in any way that would say anything about Jesus other than who his bother was, how do we know he was talking about Jesus of the bible? was there only one person around then called Jesus? if Jesus had been doing all of the fabulous things he was supposed to have done I would have thought it was worth a mention, don't you?
I'm bringing a knife to a gun fight? you haven't even got a knife.
OK I will concede that Jesus was a real person now what? miracles? raising the dead?
You do know that there were at least three or four Gods before Jesus who all had the same MO.
born 25 Dec of a virgin, crucified, rose from the dead, these stories were old before Jesus was even born.
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I'm tempted to quote Gandhi here, "I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."
That doesn't quite fit, for me, I actually like most Christians I know. I do believe some of the more "religious" Christians I have run across seem to have created a "Christ" in their own image. Though I am wondering if you wanted someone to bring up this quote, since you mentioned Gandhi.
For all the recent talk of Sodom and Gomorrah, I can't help go back to what Ezekiel had to say about those cities: "Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy." Sounds a lot like the US today -- particularly many of the religious conservatives.
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