Arson, hate crimes may be behind black church fires across US

Biblicist

Full Gospel believer
Mar 27, 2011
7,023
992
Melbourne, Australia
✟43,594.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
I came across an interesting article on RT.com which spoke about how there appears to be a number of African-American churches being burnt to the ground recently. (link)

Is this a discussion point within the US church or is it something that is still off the radar?

"Six mainly African-American churches in five US states have burned down since the deadly attack on parishioners in Charleston, and officials say at least three fires were set deliberately. The arson cases are being investigated as possible hate crimes.

Historically black churches in Tennessee, North and South Carolina, Florida, and Georgia have been damaged or destroyed in fires that began last Monday. In two cases, the fires may have resulted from natural causes, while three were determined to be arson, and one is still being investigated".​
 

Biblicist

Full Gospel believer
Mar 27, 2011
7,023
992
Melbourne, Australia
✟43,594.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
Okay, maybe the Charismatic forum is comprised of mainly white Believers!

I would have thought that by now that there would have been a lot of comment that expressed outrage at this wicked development. I wonder if anyone would have commented if someone had pulled a Rose out of the garden of a predominantly white church?
 
Upvote 0

SpiritPsalmist

Heavy lean toward Messianic
Supporter
Jun 13, 2002
21,665
1,466
70
Southeast Kansas
✟393,824.00
Country
United States
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Single
I read the same article. It truly is a wicked development. One of the first churches I went to when I moved to Florida was predominantly white, there was one black family. On Wed when someone would drive the bus to pick up kids to come to church it would be mostly black children. I was appaled that the pastor asked the driver why he could not pick up white kids instead. :( After that I went to a church where one Sunday we counted the different countries people were from and there were over 20. I loved that church...the worship was awesome 'cause even the worship team was made up of people from at least 3-4 different countries.

As I heard Jesse Duplantes say, "God only made one race....the human race". I would hope that our white churches would rise up and come to the aid of these people, they are our brothers and sisters in the Lord.
 
Upvote 0

Presbyterian Continuist

Senior Veteran
Supporter
Mar 28, 2005
21,810
10,792
76
Christchurch New Zealand
Visit site
✟827,033.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
People, even religious people who discriminate on the basis of colour and culture are not abiding by the law of love, which is the spirit of Christ. Because these people do not have the spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ at all. These people need God to work in them to make up the lack they have in their experience of God, because they don't know God and what He is really like. The first step for these religious folks is to become genuinely converted to Christ. They need to get that message loud and clear. You can't be a genuine believer and a redneck at the same time! You either are one or the other. A redneck is totally in the flesh and therefore cannot please God. To get into a place where they are pleasing God they have to renounce that attitude and see other folks, black, white, red or yellow in the same way as Christ sees them,
 
Upvote 0

ToBeLoved

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jan 3, 2014
18,705
5,790
✟322,365.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Okay, maybe the Charismatic forum is comprised of mainly white Believers!

I would have thought that by now that there would have been a lot of comment that expressed outrage at this wicked development. I wonder if anyone would have commented if someone had pulled a Rose out of the garden of a predominantly white church?

I think it is a good discussion, because we are called to 1) love and 2) to be partial to the body of Christ.

There are some white supremeist types in certain churches. It is sick, unloving and ungodly. I think it would be like a Christianized KKK or something. Part of US history that is ugly, very ugly.
 
Upvote 0

Presbyterian Continuist

Senior Veteran
Supporter
Mar 28, 2005
21,810
10,792
76
Christchurch New Zealand
Visit site
✟827,033.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
There are some white supremeist types in certain churches. It is sick, unloving and ungodly. I think it would be like a Christianized KKK or something. Part of US history that is ugly, very ugly.

These people might be very religious but they are unconverted. They need the gospel as much as any unsaved people need it, otherwise they will get to the Judgment and Christ will say, "I never knew you. Depart from Me you wicked people!"
 
Upvote 0

ToBeLoved

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jan 3, 2014
18,705
5,790
✟322,365.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
These people might be very religious but they are unconverted. They need the gospel as much as any unsaved people need it, otherwise they will get to the Judgment and Christ will say, "I never knew you. Depart from Me you wicked people!"

Yup! Agree 100% Oscar.
 
Upvote 0

Svt4Him

Legend
Supporter
Oct 23, 2003
16,711
1,132
52
Visit site
✟53,618.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Politics
CA-Conservatives
Okay, maybe the Charismatic forum is comprised of mainly white Believers!

I would have thought that by now that there would have been a lot of comment that expressed outrage at this wicked development. I wonder if anyone would have commented if someone had pulled a Rose out of the garden of a predominantly white church?

Probably not, it's just getting silly how much racism is playing a part in the dialogue today, and equally amazing how much of it is directed at white people.

86% of white victims are killed by white people, 94% of black victims are killed by blacks people. But the ones that get into the news are always white people doing something, and it gets silly after a while.

So the idea that anyone would comment about a rose is in itself indicative of a greater problem of race baiting.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

hislegacy

Memories pre 2021
Supporter
Nov 15, 2006
43,649
13,930
Broken Arrow, OK
✟689,031.00
Country
United States
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I came across an interesting article on RT.com which spoke about how there appears to be a number of African-American churches being burnt to the ground recently. (link)

Is this a discussion point within the US church or is it something that is still off the radar?

"Six mainly African-American churches in five US states have burned down since the deadly attack on parishioners in Charleston, and officials say at least three fires were set deliberately. The arson cases are being investigated as possible hate crimes.

Historically black churches in Tennessee, North and South Carolina, Florida, and Georgia have been damaged or destroyed in fires that began last Monday. In two cases, the fires may have resulted from natural causes, while three were determined to be arson, and one is still being investigated".​

Very valid question and not race baiting whatsoever.

It is more a prayer and action point than it is a discussion point, at least with our church. Prayers for the families and church member have been happening since day one. We have also sent funds.

What is powerful is how they have been reacting.
 
Upvote 0

RDKirk

Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner
Supporter
Mar 3, 2013
39,137
20,169
US
✟1,440,830.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I'm glad to take up this discussion in this area of the forum. In case anyone doesn't know, I've been black for over 60 years. I didn't say I was "African-American," I said I'm black. look at my signature for my world view.

I am frustrated by the inability of people in the Body of Christ even to attempt to discern the tactics of the Enemy.

Back during the Vietnam war, I had a cousin who was the only black member of a US army squad. They went out into an area of significant combat on an overnight patrol. My cousin was supposed to have been awakened at 0200 hours to begin his guard shift, but instead he awakened that morning to daylight. He looked around at the other members of his squad--all white men--and discovered that all of their throats had been cut, leaving him the only survivor.

He made his way back to the US base unharmed--nobody attacked him. But all the way, he heard shouts and calls from the enemy: "This is not your war. Don't fight for the white man. Go home."

Now, let us discern the strategy and tactics of the enemy. Was this attack of the enemy an attack specifically against whites? That is, did the enemy wake up that morning and decide, "We don't like white people, so let's just kill the white men?"

No, the strategy of the enemy was to create division, doubt, and distrust among the ranks of the US soldiers. Their tactic for doing so was to strike at a gap they saw in the US bulwark: The racial discord they were reading about in the US media.

Let there be no mistake: The enemy was not favoring black US soldiers over white US soldiers. This was a tactic to carry out a strategy that would defeat all US soldiers.
 
Upvote 0

ToBeLoved

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jan 3, 2014
18,705
5,790
✟322,365.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
I don't think that there is any lack of caring, but maybe as Christians we know that there are some strange beliefs by people. I don't see how anyone who is racist could even read the Bible and not see that any racism is in no way tolerated by God. However, somehow Christian's who are racist and believe that the BIble is the Word of God must be somehow able to reconcile the Word of God back to their own racist beliefs. I have never really understood exactly how they do this, because in the case of people who are racist against the Jewish race, how can they reconcile that back to the Hebrews and Israelite's being God's chosen people? Makes no sense to me.

Also, the words 'God so loved the world that He gave His Only Begotten Son, that whomever believes in Him shall have eternal life'. IMHO, whomever is all, so given that the world is a mixture of many races and cultures, I don't understand how racism could be seen as acceptable to God.

With that said, I don't see how people can reconcile a lot of unloving and uncaring things back to Christianity. So, I guess in my mind although it bothers me a lot hearing about these churches, it does not surprise me that some people can be so unloving and ugly yet still think that they are Christians.
 
Upvote 0

RDKirk

Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner
Supporter
Mar 3, 2013
39,137
20,169
US
✟1,440,830.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I don't think that there is any lack of caring, but maybe as Christians we know that there are some strange beliefs by people. I don't see how anyone who is racist could even read the Bible and not see that any racism is in no way tolerated by God. However, somehow Christian's who are racist and believe that the BIble is the Word of God must be somehow able to reconcile the Word of God back to their own racist beliefs. I have never really understood exactly how they do this, because in the case of people who are racist against the Jewish race, how can they reconcile that back to the Hebrews and Israelite's being God's chosen people? Makes no sense to me.

Also, the words 'God so loved the world that He gave His Only Begotten Son, that whomever believes in Him shall have eternal life'. IMHO, whomever is all, so given that the world is a mixture of many races and cultures, I don't understand how racism could be seen as acceptable to God.

With that said, I don't see how people can reconcile a lot of unloving and uncaring things back to Christianity. So, I guess in my mind although it bothers me a lot hearing about these churches, it does not surprise me that some people can be so unloving and ugly yet still think that they are Christians.

Frankly, I believe it's the work of an evil principality that descended on the American South around 1800. It must be noted that prior to that time, everyone in the Christian world had always looked at slavery in the same light as rumrunning and prostitution. Even though men made much money from it, it was still always seen as an evil.

That was true in America even among slaveholders right until about 1800 when the rhetoric suddenly changed. Then, for the first time ever, Christians in the American South began to justify slavery from the scriptures. That had never happened before. In earlier eras, slavery had been tolerated by the Church under Romans 13--something that kings did to manage their kingdoms, but not as something that was righteous in itself under God. What the Christians in the South did was not only unusual but was also in opposition to every other Christian group in the world. By that time, not only were other Christians not defending slavery, but were actively fighting it. The Pope, for instance, had banned it, but Catholic American Southerners ignored him. So I believe something very particular and evil was happening in the American South at that time.

I think that demon still holds sway in the South, despite the bible thumping, as witnessed by the fact that all the demographics of the area are those of a third world nation, depressed and oppressed by something nobody is acknowledging.
 
Upvote 0

ToBeLoved

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jan 3, 2014
18,705
5,790
✟322,365.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Frankly, I believe it's the work of an evil principality that descended on the American South around 1800. It must be noted that prior to that time, everyone in the Christian world had always looked at slavery in the same light as rumrunning and prostitution. Even though men made much money from it, it was still always seen as an evil.

That was true in America even among slaveholders right until about 1800 when the rhetoric suddenly changed. Then, for the first time ever, Christians in the American South began to justify slavery from the scriptures. That had never happened before. In earlier eras, slavery had been tolerated by the Church under Romans 13--something that kings did to manage their kingdoms, but not as something that was righteous in itself under God. What the Christians in the South did was not only unusual but was also in opposition to every other Christian group in the world. By that time, not only were other Christians not defending slavery, but were actively fighting it. The Pope, for instance, had banned it, but Catholic American Southerners ignored him. So I believe something very particular and evil was happening in the American South at that time.

I think that demon still holds sway in the South, despite the bible thumping, as witnessed by the fact that all the demographics of the area are those of a third world nation, depressed and oppressed by something nobody is acknowledging.

Very interesting.

I've only ever lived in Wisconsin, so I don't really have any experience in the south. I've heard there are differences and some who have moved here have said that we are much less racist here, but I have nothing to compare it to.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Biblicist

Full Gospel believer
Mar 27, 2011
7,023
992
Melbourne, Australia
✟43,594.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
I'm glad to take up this discussion in this area of the forum. In case anyone doesn't know, I've been black for over 60 years. I didn't say I was "African-American," I said I'm black. look at my signature for my world view.
With reference to ToBeLoved’s comment below; almost three years ago my wife and I spent six wonderful weeks travelling around the USA where we probably did about 5000 Km driving through 12 States. Now this self-confessed anti-racist suddenly discovered that he was maybe a bit racist without even knowing it.

Quote: ToBeLoved said:
I don't think that there is any lack of caring, but maybe as Christians we know that there are some strange beliefs by people. I don't see how anyone who is racist could even read the Bible and not see that any racism is in no way tolerated by God.
On our first night we were staying at the Radisson Suites in Buena Park CA just north of Knott’s Berry Farm on Beach Blvd. As our vacation was somewhat of a photographic adventure, after tea we decided to go for a walk with our expensive cameras to try and capture a bit of night life. Here’s where I will now confess (with apologies) how my hidden racism came to the surface.

Sadly, as the American film industry has presented to the world that America is a violent country, which seems to be the opinion of my Christian friends here in Australia who wondered why we were going to the US and not Europe; we tend to contrast the US as being represented by Disneyland and Las Vegas with its make-believe and entertainment and Europe with its centuries old culture and traditions … we did Disneyland on day 2.

Now to return to my shame. As your media tends to give the impression that white people are likely to be either robbed or assaulted by black Americans or by those from Spanish descent, when we were walking out the front door of the hotel I was admittedly secretly wondering if a car of maybe black people would stop and accost us. Thankfully my paranoia quickly disappeared but it did make me realise that my racist profiling or maybe pre-conditioning by the US entertainment industry had allowed me to develop a few unhealthy and unwarranted predjuices.

When I discuss (or often where I find myself defending) certain American values, I have to explain that the US was not founded so much with values of equality and freedom where this legacy has filtered down to the current day.
 
Upvote 0

Biblicist

Full Gospel believer
Mar 27, 2011
7,023
992
Melbourne, Australia
✟43,594.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
Frankly, I believe it's the work of an evil principality that descended on the American South around 1800. It must be noted that prior to that time, everyone in the Christian world had always looked at slavery in the same light as rumrunning and prostitution. Even though men made much money from it, it was still always seen as an evil.
If the first American Civil War (1776) had not occurred, then the US would have been compelled to abolish slavery when the British Empire abolished the slave trade in 1808 and slavery itself in 1838.

This would have also stopped the carnage of the second Civil War (1861-65) where an estimated 650,000 (or maybe 800,000) Americans died.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums