Yahweh the Warlord - Just Killings

AlephBet · May 6, 2015

Let me start by saying that I believe Yahweh exists. I also believe that he sent Jesus to die on a cross. I do not doubt this. What I do doubt is his intent. I do not agree with our Lord's desire for war. His intent (by design) is unholy.

Should we worship a warlord? I recently woke up to this deception and no longer worship this evil. My question for you is this: How can you worship this, knowing that he made Satan in Genesis 3:1? What can you say that would convince me this is righteous? Before I walk away from this completely, convince me this is Love. Show me why Yahweh fights the very enemy he made. Why should we support this madness?

Exodus 15:3
Yahweh is a warrior! Yahweh is his name.

Exodus 17:16
He said, “Because a hand was lifted against Yah’s throne, Yahweh will be at war against the Amalekites from one generation to the next.”

Numbers 21:14
This is how it’s described in the Book of the Wars of Yahweh: “. . . Waheb in Suphah and the valleys,

Numbers 31:3
Moses said to the people, “Some of your men must get ready to go to war against the Midianites. Yahweh will use them to get even with Midian.

Numbers 31:7
They went to war against Midian, as Yahweh commanded Moses, and killed every man.

People can be collected as a tax...

Numbers 31:28
Collect a tax for Yahweh. From the soldiers who served in the war collect one out of every 500 things. This includes people, cattle, donkeys, sheep, and goats.

Deuteronomy 4:34
Or has any god ever tried to come and take one nation away from another for himself? Yahweh your Elohim used his mighty hand and powerful arm to do this for you in Egypt. He did this using plagues, miraculous signs, amazing things, and war. He did his great and awe-inspiring deeds in front of you.

Judges 3:1
These are the nations Yahweh left behind to test all the Israelites who had not experienced any war in Canaan.

And finally, Jesus claims the same:

Revelation 19:11 - I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and wages war.

Yahweh's desire is to make war on heaven itself, then rule from Earth:

Isaiah 24

On that day Yahweh will punish heaven’s armies in heaven
and earth’s kings on earth.
22 They’ll be gathered like prisoners in a jail
and locked in prison.
After a long time they’ll be punished.
23 The moon will be embarrassed.
The sun will be ashamed,
because Yahweh Tsebaoth will rule
on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem.
He will be glorious
in the presence of his respected leaders.

I have concluded this: If you are looking for the source of suffering in the world, look no further than Yahweh and the Satan he made. What would you say to me to justify this Warlord's actions? The nations are clearly deceived by division. Unless someone can justify this as love, our enemy is the one who made Satan Cunning (Arum). Mankind is still naked (Arummim). Wordplay seems to suggest that Yahweh is the one we must overcome.

What do you say to me in defense of this? If Yahweh's just war comes to your country, will you bless his holy name? I believe that it must be possible to defend Yahweh if he is good and that an answer must come from those who worship him. This thread should get many responses if defense of Yahweh's intent is possible. Are you willing to make war in heaven against the armies of heaven with Yahweh? I will not. I know him by his fruit. Love keeps no record of wrongs if you believe Paul. If you believe 1 John 1, God is Love.

Is Yahweh love?

BTW: These verses are NOT out of context to the topic of war as a righteous method of eduction. War is the central theme of Yahweh's use of bloodshed against this verse:

Genesis 9

6 Whoever sheds human blood,
by humans his blood will be shed,
because in his image, Elohim made humans.

Was HIS messiah's blood shed by human hands? Yes. Elohim is not Yahweh. Yahweh made himself the Elohim of Israel. One nation is not the promise of blessing to the NATIONS (Rainbow) that came next in Genesis 9.

What do I believe? I believe there is a true God that will stomp Yahweh in the end. How? By showing us his error. God can only give. When he gives us knowledge, we will overcome with Spirit. God will take nothing. What he gives will clothe us with true righteousness. That righteousness has nothing to do with war. Thieves take. God gives.

Did Yahweh take?

Know the truth. Be set free from the error. Your turn. Defend Yahweh if you worship him. Show me how I am wrong.

1213 · May 6, 2015

AlephBet said:
What do you say to me in defense of this? If Yahweh's just war comes to your country, will you bless his holy name? I believe that it must be possible to defend

If God decides that someone must die, I believe it is good and right. According to the Bible, eternal life is for righteous. If unrighteous people would also get eternal life, they would turn that eternal suffering for all. That is why I think it is good and righteous, if God dont allow unrighteous people to live forever.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46

I dont think war is what God wants, but it can be something that is needed, when the unrighteousness of men exceeds certain point. And actually I believe war begins always when people or fallen angels want it and God allows it. I think it never comes from God.

In my opinion war is not just the battle that is done with physical arms, the main battle is spiritual. And I dont think God started it. Gods enemies started it and its results are also the earthly wars, and it has to be ended, before it destroys everything, even all good too. If God ends it by waging war that is ignited against him, I dont think it is bad or wrong. In my opinion God is just and righteous, if he ends the evilness in the world.

For our wrestling is not against flesh and blood, but against the principalities, against the powers, against the world's rulers of the darkness of this age, and against the spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.
Efe. 6:12

I hope you dont support wickedness and lies.

AlephBet · May 6, 2015

I would agree with your premise if it were not for one point. Yahweh did not just punish the King of Egypt (as one of many examples), but killed innocent children (firstborn) as punishment to the King of Egypt. In other examples, he killed many members of his own nation when David crossed him the wrong way. He killed a man for steadying the Ark. He tried to murder Moses.

Exodus 4:24
Along the way they stopped for the night. Yahweh met Moses and tried to kill him.

He desires to make war on heaven's armies as I pointed out in Isaiah 24. No defense we can raise as a theological hoop to jump through can dismiss these statements from the Bible. Unless there is something we do no know about the kingdom of God, then we must conclude that Yahweh is the Demiurge of the Gnostics. It's the only artifact we have from antiquity that explains his nature.

Primary to this evidence is the Genesis 2 account where we meet Yahweh for the first time. He did not create, but planted, formed and made. Bara (create from nothing) was not used. Bara IS used for Elohim in Genesis 1. Elohim said, "Let US make man in OUR image..." Of course, that was reference to Elohim and Ruach Elohim (Feminine Spirit) introduced at the head of Genesis 1.

We then have Yahweh speak in Genesis 8, followed by Elohim speaking in Genesis 9. Elohim (Father) says this:

6 Whoever sheds human blood,
by humans his blood will be shed,
because in his image, Elohim made humans.

What is the motive for the following two items?

1) Satan was made cunning (Arum). Man was made naked (Arummim). This wordplay shows that man was absent any knowledge. Satan had knowledge. He was clothed with it. What reason would Yahweh have for dividing Adam's image (both male and female) to make Eve? Look closely at the verses above. Why did Elohim state that bloodshed was wrong? Because of the image. Who shed Adam's blood to get the rib? Yahweh.

In the end, I believe Adam to be the Son of God. Luke 3 even tells us this.

37 son of Methuselah, son of Enoch, son of Jared, son of Mahalaleel, son of Cainan,
38 son of Enos, son of Seth,
son of Adam,
son of God.

2) Yahweh is what made Satan. Does the fruit (Satan) fall far from the tree (Yahweh)?

Did Elohim create Adam in HIS image? Yes. BOTH male and female, which is where we return. We are not given in marriage later, after the resurrection, because we are again joined bride and groom.

Matthew 22
At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven.

Back in Matthew 18, we are given the key to this from the parable of the wandering sheep.

10 “Be careful not to despise these little ones. I can guarantee that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father, who is in heaven.

Of course, the bride is Eve refined to Mary. She is the feminine weak spirit in the wilderness. Adam is the male, or Angel. Above, we have a groom. Below, we are the wandering sheep (Child of God).

Again, who made the Snake and let him loose in the Garden? God? No. Yahweh.

If you then put it all together, you get this picture that Paul paints for us.

Colossians 1

15 Christ is as God is. God cannot be seen. Christ lived before anything was made. 16 Christ made everything in the heavens and on the earth. He made everything that is seen and things that are not seen. He made all the powers of heaven. Everything was made by Him and for Him. 17 Christ was before all things. All things are held together by Him. 18 Christ is the head of the church which is His body. He is the beginning of all things.

Based on the verses above, name me one thing that is NOT the Son of God. You can't. We are ALL the Son. Every reference to Satan, Yahweh, Adam, the tree in your front yard and the galaxy above is reference to one entity. We are that entity God is refining. If we judge them as enemies, we judge our own selves. We are the image reflected below (Eve). They are the images above. There is a reason we should not judge. We ARE supposed to overcome.

Who are we overcoming? The image and that character is one name. The Son of God. Lord of Hosts. Satan's maker. The one made sin. The lamb slain. We are him.

Unless we judge Yahweh correctly, we have failed to overcome our own fallen nature. Yahweh IS that fallen nature.

Galatians 3

23 Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.
Who is our guardian? Our own nature reflected back to us by the image. What we seen in Yahweh is not God, but the opposite reflection. Until we fix our own nature, we cannot match that of the true God. He is NOT Yahweh. We are. God is not Satan. We are. God is not Jesus. We are. We are the body. The head of our soul is above. As Matthew 18 points out, we are child. Our Angle faces God.

Unless we see your SELF in the whole, we only worship the idol that is ME. It's not ME. It's WE. Yahweh is not the top. He's simply us looking in the mirror. Of course, we have nothing else to found this on other than speculation. ALL of theology is presupposition as speculative revelation. NONE of us have Gnosis. We ALL have Pistis (Faith). No direct knowledge for us. We must believe a book only. I choose to speculate the truth from what the word says and not what theology tells me to think.

Like I said. I believe it. I do not agree. I believe the true God is faithful. I do not believe Jesus is good. I do not believe Yahweh is good.

Luke 18:19 "Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good--except God alone.

I believe what they have told us. What they say confirms that they are not God.

daq · May 7, 2015

AlephBet said:
I would agree with your premise if it were not for one point. Yahweh did not just punish the King of Egypt (as one of many examples), but killed innocent children (firstborn) as punishment to the King of Egypt. In other examples, he killed many members of his own nation when David crossed him the wrong way. He killed a man for steadying the Ark. He tried to murder Moses.

Exodus 4:24
Along the way they stopped for the night. Yahweh met Moses and tried to kill him.

He desires to make war on heaven's armies as I pointed out in Isaiah 24. No defense we can raise as a theological hoop to jump through can dismiss these statements from the Bible. Unless there is something we do no know about the kingdom of God, then we must conclude that Yahweh is the Demiurge of the Gnostics. It's the only artifact we have from antiquity that explains his nature.

Primary to this evidence is the Genesis 2 account where we meet Yahweh for the first time. He did not create, but planted, formed and made. Bara (create from nothing) was not used. Bara IS used for Elohim in Genesis 1. Elohim said, "Let US make man in OUR image..." Of course, that was reference to Elohim and Ruach Elohim (Feminine Spirit) introduced at the head of Genesis 1.

We then have Yahweh speak in Genesis 8, followed by Elohim speaking in Genesis 9. Elohim (Father) says this:

6 Whoever sheds human blood,
by humans his blood will be shed,
because in his image, Elohim made humans.

What is the motive for the following two items?

1) Satan was made cunning (Arum). Man was made naked (Arummim). This wordplay shows that man was absent any knowledge. Satan had knowledge. He was clothed with it. What reason would Yahweh have for dividing Adam's image (both male and female) to make Eve? Look closely at the verses above. Why did Elohim state that bloodshed was wrong? Because of the image. Who shed Adam's blood to get the rib? Yahweh.

In the end, I believe Adam to be the Son of God. Luke 3 even tells us this.

37 son of Methuselah, son of Enoch, son of Jared, son of Mahalaleel, son of Cainan,
38 son of Enos, son of Seth,
son of Adam,
son of God.

2) Yahweh is what made Satan. Does the fruit (Satan) fall far from the tree (Yahweh)?

Did Elohim create Adam in HIS image? Yes. BOTH male and female, which is where we return. We are not given in marriage later, after the resurrection, because we are again joined bride and groom.

Matthew 22
At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven.

Back in Matthew 18, we are given the key to this from the parable of the wandering sheep.

10 Be careful not to despise these little ones. I can guarantee that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father, who is in heaven.

Of course, the bride is Eve refined to Mary. She is the feminine weak spirit in the wilderness. Adam is the male, or Angel. Above, we have a groom. Below, we are the wandering sheep (Child of God).

Again, who made the Snake and let him loose in the Garden? God? No. Yahweh.

If you then put it all together, you get this picture that Paul paints for us.

Colossians 1

15 Christ is as God is. God cannot be seen. Christ lived before anything was made. 16 Christ made everything in the heavens and on the earth. He made everything that is seen and things that are not seen. He made all the powers of heaven. Everything was made by Him and for Him. 17 Christ was before all things. All things are held together by Him. 18 Christ is the head of the church which is His body. He is the beginning of all things.

Based on the verses above, name me one thing that is NOT the Son of God. You can't. We are ALL the Son. Every reference to Satan, Yahweh, Adam, the tree in your front yard and the galaxy above is reference to one entity. We are that entity God is refining. If we judge them as enemies, we judge our own selves. We are the image reflected below (Eve). They are the images above. There is a reason we should not judge. We ARE supposed to overcome.

Who are we overcoming? The image and that character is one name. The Son of God. Lord of Hosts. Satan's maker. The one made sin. The lamb slain. We are him.

Unless we judge Yahweh correctly, we have failed to overcome our own fallen nature. Yahweh IS that fallen nature.

Galatians 3

23 Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.
Who is our guardian? Our own nature reflected back to us by the image. What we seen in Yahweh is not God, but the opposite reflection. Until we fix our own nature, we cannot match that of the true God. He is NOT Yahweh. We are. God is not Satan. We are. God is not Jesus. We are. We are the body. The head of our soul is above. As Matthew 18 points out, we are child. Our Angle faces God.

Unless we see your SELF in the whole, we only worship the idol that is ME. It's not ME. It's WE. Yahweh is not the top. He's simply us looking in the mirror. Of course, we have nothing else to found this on other than speculation. ALL of theology is presupposition as speculative revelation. NONE of us have Gnosis. We ALL have Pistis (Faith). No direct knowledge for us. We must believe a book only. I choose to speculate the truth from what the word says and not what theology tells me to think.

Like I said. I believe it. I do not agree. I believe the true God is faithful. I do not believe Jesus is good. I do not believe Yahweh is good.

Luke 18:19 "Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good--except God alone.

I believe what they have told us. What they say confirms that they are not God.

It seems that by way of your in depth studies you have come to the revelation not that YHWH is "our fallen nature" but rather that the fallen nature of man has corrupted the Masoretic Text for rejecting the Testimony of Yeshua. If you would now go back and study the first few chapters of Septuagint Genesis with the same enthusiasm you will see that it was the Elohim which formed man in Genesis 2:7. Likewise Eve does not say that she received a man, (Cain) from YHWH but rather from the Elohim. In the Septuagint Exodus the glory of the Elohim is the cloud which covers mount Sinai but the glory of YHWH is the flaming fire upon the top of the mountain, (Exodus 24:15-18). They thus have two different glories and it appears you have reversed the two for not rightly dividing and because of the tragic tampering with the Masoretic Text which came a thousand years later being compiled by unbelievers.

AlephBet · May 7, 2015

daq said:
It seems that by way of your in depth studies you have come to the revelation not that YHWH is "our fallen nature" but rather that the fallen nature of man has corrupted the Masoretic Text for rejecting the Testimony of Yeshua. If you would now go back and study the first few chapters of Septuagint Genesis with the same enthusiasm you will see that it was the Elohim which formed man in Genesis 2:7. Likewise Eve does not say that she received a man, (Cain) from YHWH but rather from the Elohim. In the Septuagint Exodus the glory of the Elohim is the cloud which covers mount Sinai but the glory of YHWH is the flaming fire upon the top of the mountain, (Exodus 24:15-18). They thus have two different glories and it appears you have reversed the two for not rightly dividing and because of the tragic tampering with the Masoretic Text which came a thousand years later being compiled by unbelievers.

Are you implying that the text was changed and that you alone have the understanding of how it should read? I choose to simply read the text and believe that it is preserved, even from tampering by Yahweh.

Elohim is the Father of Genesis 1. Ruach Elohim is the second character we read about. Ruach is Feminine. Together, they say, "Let US make Adam in OUR image." From this, we meet the Son of God. The word Bara is used as Create from nothing.

In Genesis 2, we then meet Yahweh. Yahweh FORMS, PLANTS and MAKES. He never creates. He then divides Adam to get Eve. How? Shedding blood, which is his trademark on his garden.

Elohim then says this in Genesis 9:

6 Whoever sheds human blood,
by humans his blood will be shed,
because in his image, Elohim made humans.

We know there is a reason he prohibited the shedding of human blood? Yes. Because Yahweh shed Adam's blood, causing the fall and need for the flood (baptism). Death required that God saves those who perished. Note that by Genesis 4, Yahweh Elohim becomes simply Yahweh. He then chooses ONE nation from the Rainbow to bless, dividing the entire world against HIS nation. Since he could not overrule Elohim, he defied his Father to rule a nation.

8 Elohim also said to Noah and his sons, 9 “I am going to make my promise[a] to you, your descendants, 10 and every living being that is with you—birds, domestic animals, and all the wild animals, all those that came out of the ship—every living thing on earth. 11 I am making my promise to you. Never again will all life be killed by floodwaters. Never again will there be a flood that destroys the earth.”
12 Elohim said, “This is the sign of the promise I am giving to you and every living being that is with you for generations to come. 13 I will put my rainbow in the clouds to be a sign of my promise to the earth. 14 Whenever I form clouds over the earth, a rainbow will appear in the clouds. 15 Then I will remember my promise to you and every living animal. Never again will water become a flood to destroy all life. 16 Whenever the rainbow appears in the clouds, I will see it and remember my everlasting promise to every living animal on earth.”
17 So Elohim said to Noah, “This is the sign of the promise I am making to all life on earth.”

Yahweh selected one color from the rainbow. By this, we know his fruit.

Who is Yahweh? The image of man's ego. Satan is the Conscience (Accuser). We must overcome our own self. Self is the collective soul of humanity to rule itself (EGO). Yahweh is our voice.

We must overcome our Ego to rule (Judge). Satan is the conscience telling us why. Until we give this authority back to God, we are declaring ourselves God with none beside. Yahweh.

ALL rulers, powers and authorities are In and Through Adam (the Son of God). Colossians 1 tells you this. ALL things ARE the Son.

daq · May 7, 2015

AlephBet said:
Are you implying that the text was changed and that you alone have the understanding of how it should read? I choose to simply read the text and believe that it is preserved, even from tampering by Yahweh.

I can assure you that I was not among the authors/translators of the Septuagint. Perhaps you might do as I suggested and read it as it is preserved in the Septuagint a thousand years before the Masoretic.

AlephBet said:
Elohim is the Father of Genesis 1. Ruach Elohim is the second character we read about. Ruach is Feminine. Together, they say, "Let US make Adam in OUR image." From this, we meet the Son of God. The word Bara is used as Create from nothing.

Perhaps heed the words of Yeshua bin Nun and believe that bara' can truly be meant in the sense of cutting down trees. Nothing was made from nothing but rather what was made came forth from within the Speaker. All things were created through the Elohim and nothing that came into being came into being without the Elohim.

AlephBet said:
In Genesis 2, we then meet Yahweh. Yahweh FORMS, PLANTS and MAKES. He never creates. He then divides Adam to get Eve. How? Shedding blood, which is his trademark on his garden.

"ho Theos" = "the Elohim"

Genesis 2:7-9 LXX-Septuagint
7 καὶ ἔπλασεν ὁ Θεὸς τὸν ἄνθρωπον, χοῦν ἀπὸ τῆς γῆς, καὶ ἐνεφύσησεν εἰς τὸ πρόσωπον αὐτοῦ πνοὴν ζωῆς, καὶ ἐγένετο ὁ ἄνθρωπος εἰς ψυχὴν ζῶσαν.
8 Καὶ ἐφύτευσεν ὁ Θεὸς παράδεισον ἐν ᾿Εδὲμ κατὰ ἀνατολὰς καὶ ἔθετο ἐκεῖ τὸν ἄνθρωπον, ὃν ἔπλασε.
9 καὶ ἐξανέτειλεν ὁ Θεὸς ἔτι ἐκ τῆς γῆς πᾶν ξύλον ὡραῖον εἰς ὅρασιν καὶ καλὸν εἰς βρῶσιν καὶ τὸ ξύλον τῆς ζωῆς ἐν μέσῳ τοῦ παραδείσου καὶ τὸ ξύλον τοῦ εἰδέναι γνωστὸν καλοῦ καὶ πονηροῦ.
Septuagint Genesis, Ch. 2 - Part 1

Genesis 2:7-9 LXX-Septuagint (Brenton Translation)
7 And God formed the man [of] dust of the earth, and breathed upon his face the breath of life, and the man became a living soul.
8 And God planted a garden eastward in Edem, and placed there the man whom he had formed.
9 And God made to spring up also out of the earth every tree beautiful to the eye and good for food, and the tree of life in the midst of the garden, and the tree of learning the knowledge of good and evil.
Septuagint Genesis, Ch. 2 - Part 1

Genesis 2:7-9
7 And the Elohim formed the man of dust of the earth, and breathed upon his face the breath of life, and the man became a living soul.
8 And the Elohim planted a garden eastward in Edem, and placed there the man whom he had formed.
9 And the Elohim made to spring up also out of the earth every tree beautiful to the eye and good for food, and the tree of life in the midst of the garden, and the tree of learning the knowledge of good and evil.

"Kurios ho Theos" = "YHWH Elohim"

Genesis 2:18-22 LXX-Septuagint
18 Καὶ εἶπε Κύριος ὁ Θεός· οὐ καλὸν εἶναι τὸν ἄνθρωπον μόνον· ποιήσωμεν αὐτῷ βοηθὸν κατ᾿ αὐτόν.
19 καὶ ἔπλασεν ὁ Θεὸς ἔτι ἐκ τῆς γῆς πάντα τὰ θηρία τοῦ ἀγροῦ καὶ πάντα τὰ πετεινὰ τοῦ οὐρανοῦ καὶ ἤγαγεν αὐτὰ πρὸς τὸν ᾿Αδάμ, ἰδεῖν τί καλέσει αὐτά. καὶ πᾶν ὃ ἐὰν ἐκάλεσεν αὐτὸ ᾿Αδὰμ ψυχὴν ζῶσαν, τοῦτο ὄνομα αὐτῷ.
20 καὶ ἐκάλεσεν ᾿Αδὰμ ὀνόματα πᾶσι τοῖς κτήνεσι καὶ πᾶσι τοῖς πετεινοῖς τοῦ οὐρανοῦ καὶ πᾶσι τοῖς θηρίοις τοῦ ἀγροῦ· τῷ δὲ ᾿Αδὰμ οὐχ εὑρέθη βοηθὸς ὅμοιος αὐτῷ.
21 καὶ ἐπέβαλεν ὁ Θεὸς ἔκστασιν ἐπὶ τὸν ᾿Αδάμ, καὶ ὕπνωσε· καὶ ἔλαβε μίαν τῶν πλευρῶν αὐτοῦ καὶ ἀνεπλήρωσε σάρκα ἀντ᾿ αὐτῆς.
22 καὶ ᾠκοδόμησεν ὁ Θεὸς τὴν πλευράν, ἣν ἔλαβεν ἀπὸ τοῦ ᾿Αδάμ, εἰς γυναῖκα καὶ ἤγαγεν αὐτὴν πρὸς τὸν ᾿Αδάμ.
Septuagint Genesis, Ch. 2 - Part 2

Genesis 2:18-22 LXX-Septuagint (Brenton Translation)
18 And the Lord God said, [It is] not good that the man should be alone, let us make for him a help suitable to him.
19 And God formed yet farther out of the earth all the wild beasts of the field, and all the birds of the sky, and he brought them to Adam, to see what he would call them, and whatever Adam called any living creature, that was the name of it.
20 And Adam gave names to all the cattle and to all the birds of the sky, and to all the wild beasts of the field, but for Adam there was not found a help like to himself.
21 And God brought a trance upon Adam, and he slept, and he took one of his ribs, and filled up the flesh instead thereof.
22 And God formed the rib which he took from Adam into a woman, and brought her to Adam.
Septuagint Genesis, Ch. 2 - Part 2

Genesis 2:18-22
18 And YHWH Elohim said, It is not good that the man should be alone, let us make for him a help suitable to him.
19 And the Elohim formed yet farther out of the earth all the wild beasts of the field, and all the birds of the sky, and he brought them to Adam, to see what he would call them, and whatever Adam called any living creature, that was the name of it.
20 And Adam gave names to all the cattle and to all the birds of the sky, and to all the wild beasts of the field, but for Adam there was not found a help like to himself.
21 And the Elohim brought a trance upon Adam, and he slept, and he took one of his ribs, and filled up the flesh instead thereof.
22 And the Elohim formed the rib which he took from Adam into a woman, and brought her to Adam.

All I have done here is to render Kurios as YHWH and ho Theos as the Elohim yet from the text itself it is plain as day to the reader what transpired in this version of the creation account. If any being in the above passage has corporeal capabilities it is the Elohim, (the Father YHWH is non-corporeal Spirit). The Elohim therefore receive the command from the Father YHWH and carry out the creative process. However some of the Elohim afterwards became fallen ones as opposed to your version of events.

1213 · May 7, 2015

AlephBet said:
I would agree with your premise if it were not for one point. Yahweh did not just punish the King of Egypt (as one of many examples), but killed innocent children (firstborn) as punishment to the King of Egypt. In other examples, he killed many members of his own nation when David crossed him the wrong way. He killed a man for steadying the Ark. He tried to murder Moses.

How do you know that they were innocent? Can you prove that?

I dont think it is necessary bad if God kills, because he can take the person to his Kingdom (to Heaven or eternal life). It is possible that God saved those children from their parents and from suffering by killing them. I dont think death is bad, because it is possible to get eternal life. In Biblical point of view this life is just short lesson not everything and not meant to last forever.

AlephBet said:
Exodus 4:24
Along the way they stopped for the night. Yahweh met Moses and tried to kill him.

That is interesting scripture. However, I am not sure is it about Moses, because it doesnt says so. To me that scripture is too unclear and therefore I cant really comment it more than this today.

daq · May 7, 2015

1213 said:
AlephBet said:

Exodus 4:24
Along the way they stopped for the night. Yahweh met Moses and tried to kill him.

Click to expand...

That is interesting scripture. However, I am not sure is it about Moses, because it doesn’t says so. To me that scripture is too unclear and therefore I can’t really comment it more than this today.

Exodus 4:24-26 LXX-Septuagint
24 ἐγένετο δὲ ἐν τῇ ὁδῷ ἐν τῷ καταλύματι συνήντησεν αὐτῷ ἄγγελος Κυρίου καὶ ἐζήτει αὐτὸν ἀποκτεῖναι.
25 καὶ λαβοῦσα Σεπφώρα ψῆφον περιέτεμε τὴν ἀκροβυστίαν τοῦ υἱοῦ αὐτῆς καὶ προσέπεσε πρὸς τοὺς πόδας αὐτοῦ καὶ εἶπεν· ἔστη τὸ αἷμα τῆς περιτομῆς τοῦ παιδίου μου.
26 καὶ ἀπῆλθεν ἀπ᾿ αὐτοῦ, διότι εἶπεν· ἔστη τὸ αἷμα τῆς περιτομῆς τοῦ παιδίου μου.

Exodus 4:24-26
24. And it came to pass that [the] Angel of YHWH met him by the way, in the inn, and sought to slay him.
25. And Sepphora having taken a pebble-stone circumcised the foreskin of her son, and fell at his feet, [the Angel] and said, "The blood of the circumcision of my child-son is staunched!"
26. And he departed from him, because she said, "The blood of the circumcision of my child-son is staunched!"

When she says "The blood of the circumcision of my child is staunched!", (stopped) it probably means that she is attributing the blood of the circumcision of the child to the cause of the Angel meaning essentially that the blood is at his hands, (again in opposition to what the OP has surmised). This portion is therefore necessary from a prophetic standpoint for what was to come, (for, as Yeshua says, all the Prophets and the Torah prophesied until Yochanan the Immerser). And there is an answer to everything though it may not always be the answer we thought we were seeking:

Romans 15:8-10 ASV
8. For I say that Christ hath been made a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, that he might confirm the promises given unto the fathers,
9. and that the Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy; as it is written, Therefore will I give praise unto thee among the Gentiles, And sing unto thy name.
10. And again he saith, Rejoice, ye Gentiles, with his people.

Circumcision is therefore of the heart and Messiah Yeshua is the Minister thereof.

Der Alte · May 7, 2015

PreChristian Targum Jonathan Ex 4:24-26

But it was on the way, in the place of lodging that the angel of the Lord met him, and sought to kill him, because Gershom his son had not been circumcised, inasmuch as Jethro his father-in-law had not permitted him to circumcise him: but Eliezer had been circum-cised, by an agreement between them two. And Zipporah took a stone, and circumcised the foreskin of Gershom her son, and brought the severed part to the feet of the angel, the Destroyer, and said, The husband sought to circumcise, but the father-in-law obstructed him; and now let this blood of the circumcision atone for my husband. [JERUSALEM. And she circumcised the foreskin of her son, and brought before the feet of the Destroyer, and said, The husband could have circumcised, but the father-in-law did not permit him; but now, let the blood of this circumcision atone for the fault of this husband.] And the destroying angel desisted from him, so that Zipporah gave thanks, and said, How lovely is the blood of this circumcision that bath delivered my husband from the angel of destruction! [JERUSALEM. And when the Destroyer had ceased from him, Zipporah gave thanks and said, How lovely is the blood of this circumcision which hath saved my husband from the hand of the angel of death !]

daq · May 7, 2015

Der Alter said:
PreChristian Targum Jonathan Ex 4:24-26

But it was on the way, in the place of lodging that the angel of the Lord met him, and sought to kill him, because Gershom his son had not been circumcised, inasmuch as Jethro his father-in-law had not permitted him to circumcise him: but Eliezer had been circum-cised, by an agreement between them two. And Zipporah took a stone, and circumcised the foreskin of Gershom her son, and brought the severed part to the feet of the angel, the Destroyer, and said, The husband sought to circumcise, but the father-in-law obstructed him; and now let this blood of the circumcision atone for my husband. [JERUSALEM. And she circumcised the foreskin of her son, and brought before the feet of the Destroyer, and said, The husband could have circumcised, but the father-in-law did not permit him; but now, let the blood of this circumcision atone for the fault of this husband.] And the destroying angel desisted from him, so that Zipporah gave thanks, and said, How lovely is the blood of this circumcision that bath delivered my husband from the angel of destruction! [JERUSALEM. And when the Destroyer had ceased from him, Zipporah gave thanks and said, How lovely is the blood of this circumcision which hath saved my husband from the hand of the angel of death !]

Hopefully not to turn this into a circumcision debate, (not to derail the thread unless the OP desires to go in that direction) but it is interesting that it was clearly understood to be a/the Malak of YHWH even though the same is not now what we find in the Masoretic Text.

Also there is this though:

Genesis 49:5 LXX-Septuagint
5. Συμεὼν καὶ Λευΐ ἀδελφοί· συνετέλεσαν ἀδικίαν ἐξ αἱρέσεως αὐτῶν.
5. Sumeon and Levi, brethren, accomplished an injustice out of their αἱρέσεως.

And what pray tell was their haireseos?

I suppose I should leave it at that . . .

AlephBet · May 7, 2015

That is interesting scripture. However, I am not sure is it about Moses, because it doesnt says so. To me that scripture is too unclear and therefore I cant really comment it more than this today.

As for the firstborn, children are always innocent. As for the passage where Yahweh tries to murder 'him,' you are correct. It may very well have been the Son of Moses. The wife cut the foreskin from the son and touched Moses feet. As bizarre as this is, we have no way to know what it means. As with most Bible symbolism, we are in the dark. Truth that is hidden is a lie. Truth that is know uncovers the lie.

24 Along the way they stopped for the night. Yahweh met Moses and tried to kill him. 25 Then Zipporah took a flint knife, cut off her sons foreskin, and touched Moses feet with it. She said, You are a bridegroom of blood to me! 26 So Yahweh let him alone. It was because of the circumcision that she said at that time, You are a bridegroom of blood!

Yahweh cannot be God. If he is God, we're all in trouble.

AlephBet · May 7, 2015

daq said:
Exodus 4:24-26 LXX-Septuagint
24 ἐγένετο δὲ ἐν τῇ ὁδῷ ἐν τῷ καταλύματι συνήντησεν αὐτῷ ἄγγελος Κυρίου καὶ ἐζήτει αὐτὸν ἀποκτεῖναι.
25 καὶ λαβοῦσα Σεπφώρα ψῆφον περιέτεμε τὴν ἀκροβυστίαν τοῦ υἱοῦ αὐτῆς καὶ προσέπεσε πρὸς τοὺς πόδας αὐτοῦ καὶ εἶπεν· ἔστη τὸ αἷμα τῆς περιτομῆς τοῦ παιδίου μου.
26 καὶ ἀπῆλθεν ἀπ᾿ αὐτοῦ, διότι εἶπεν· ἔστη τὸ αἷμα τῆς περιτομῆς τοῦ παιδίου μου.

Exodus 4:24-26
24. And it came to pass that [the] Angel of YHWH met him by the way, in the inn, and sought to slay him.
25. And Sepphora having taken a pebble-stone circumcised the foreskin of her son, and fell at his feet, [the Angel] and said, "The blood of the circumcision of my child-son is staunched!"
26. And he departed from him, because she said, "The blood of the circumcision of my child-son is staunched!"

When she says "The blood of the circumcision of my child is staunched!", (stopped) it probably means that she is attributing the blood of the circumcision of the child to the cause of the Angel meaning essentially that the blood is at his hands, (again in opposition to what the OP has surmised). This portion is therefore necessary from a prophetic standpoint for what was to come, (for, as Yeshua says, all the Prophets and the Torah prophesied until Yochanan the Immerser). And there is an answer to everything though it may not always be the answer we thought we were seeking:

Romans 15:8-10 ASV
8. For I say that Christ hath been made a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, that he might confirm the promises given unto the fathers,
9. and that the Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy; as it is written, Therefore will I give praise unto thee among the Gentiles, And sing unto thy name.
10. And again he saith, Rejoice, ye Gentiles, with his people.

Circumcision is therefore of the heart and Messiah Yeshua is the Minister thereof.

As with all theology, these are giant assumptions. We have no way to know any of it by its true meaning. Apart from having a cultural knowledge of this behavior, we must assume and speculate. Presuppositions are founded on misconception.

I can ask very simple questions that again show the nature of Yahweh in a nutshell.

1) Who is responsible for Babel? If We were still under one common language, would we then understand what was transliterated from multiple divergent copies of scripture? Do we have the ability to do this from Hebrew to English? No. Do we have the ability to translate properly 2000 years later?

2) The writers experienced a type of Gnosis with special revelation. Can someone experience the same special revelation by reading mistranslated texts?

Would God be this imperfect?

The simpler answer is to note Jesus words about judgment. Ego is Yahweh. When we judge others, we are self-righteous. Self-righteousness is the same as wickedness. Jesus came to turn this on its heels and show that Yahweh's law had no power to save.

Are we tasked with overcoming the need for law? Are we tasked with overcoming the accuser (Satan)? Who made Satan?

Then we must overcome the law, Yahweh and Satan. They are the deception.

daq · May 8, 2015

At this point please allow me to openly state my primary intention for posting in this thread.
In your opening remarks you said the following:

AlephBet said:
Before I walk away from this completely, convince me this is Love. Show me why Yahweh fights the very enemy he made. Why should we support this madness?

For this reason I brought up the Septuagint attempting to show that there is indeed another avenue of research which it appears you have not yet fully investigated. Not only that but the New Testament authors quote extensively from either the Septuagint or another manuscript which was much closer to the Septuagint because there are many passages quoted which match the Septuagint word for word as if they were lifted straight out of the Septuagint while not conforming to the corresponding companion passages in the Masoretic Text. Now therefore, if indeed you decide to completely walk away from all of this, it will not be due to having exhausted all avenues of research but rather simply because you will have chosen to do so. You now have a seriously different venue to investigate more fully, and that text, the Septuagint, varies widely from the text you now assume to be the superior text, the Masoretic, (which in fact, as already stated, came a thousand years after the Septuagint and comes even after both the Jerusalem and Babylonian Talmud were compiled which in itself should be a red flag). I would suggest that you have a long road ahead of you before completely walking away from all of this, (said with all due respect and care).

AlephBet said:
As with all theology, these are giant assumptions. We have no way to know any of it by its true meaning. Apart from having a cultural knowledge of this behavior, we must assume and speculate. Presuppositions are founded on misconception.

I can ask very simple questions that again show the nature of Yahweh in a nutshell.

1) Who is responsible for Babel? If We were still under one common language, would we then understand what was transliterated from multiple divergent copies of scripture? Do we have the ability to do this from Hebrew to English? No. Do we have the ability to translate properly 2000 years later?

Again that reveals the critical importance of the Septuagint because it was rendered, (surely at least the Torah portions) well before the advent of Messiah and therefore rendered with much less bias. Likewise it was translated from the ancient text they had at the time by the best and the brightest of the Jews and Priesthood who spoke both Hebrew and Greek 2300 years before now. Who is to say that their text was much different than the Masoretic we have today? It may not have been but that only shows the inferiority of modern English translations and the massive amount of understanding that has been lost to modern scholarship concerning Hebrew. The Septuagint therefore becomes even more critical because itself is an ancient translation of Hebrew idioms, ideas, concepts, and sayings into the Greek language by those who knew their own Hebrew-Aramaic language like the back of their own hands. The Septuagint alone reveals that there is no such thing as a "word for word" translation because it simply is not possible to relate entire ideas through two or three words from one language into another.

AlephBet said:
2) The writers experienced a type of Gnosis with special revelation. Can someone experience the same special revelation by reading mistranslated texts?

Would God be this imperfect?

The writers had a different culture which needs to be more fully investigated, and hopefully better understood, but the Testimony of Yeshua contains the keys which unlock all of the gnosis hidden in the ancient writings. The one who knows the Testimony of Yeshua will begin to see what is true and what has been tampered with.

AlephBet said:
The simpler answer is to note Jesus words about judgment. Ego is Yahweh. When we judge others, we are self-righteous. Self-righteousness is the same as wickedness. Jesus came to turn this on its heels and show that Yahweh's law had no power to save.

Are we tasked with overcoming the need for law? Are we tasked with overcoming the accuser (Satan)? Who made Satan?

Then we must overcome the law, Yahweh and Satan. They are the deception.

"Anabatehode!",

(third heaven and Paradise) even as Paul learned it from the Revelation of Yeshua, (11). For when the nations not having the Law do by nature the things of the Law; those not having the Law are unto themselves a law, who show forth the work of the law written in their hearts: the inner law jointly witnessing-testifying together with their conscience unto them, and between one another the resulting thoughts Accusing or even making a defense in the Day when Elohim shall judge the secrets of men according to the good message I have received through Revelation of Messiah Yeshua. No one outsmarts the Great Psychologist who made us all. Your conscience is like one of two witnesses and and your inner law is the other; and if your conscience is guilty then your own resulting thoughts will be your Accuser. Therefore Yeshua says, Go, and sin no more, lest a worse thing come to you, (for the unclean spirit cast out goes through dry-desert places like a scapegoat in the wilderness, seeking rest and fining none; and then he goes and gets seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and the eighth is of the seven). In the End YHWH is going to kill that half of you that is killing you; and if you overcome in that day you will rejoice in the afterglow.

Colter · May 8, 2015

The scriptures were written by holy men, some more holy than others. In them God is created in mans own image, that's why he has many of the emotions and attributes of man.

In Babylon the Hebrew priest rewrote the OT books and destroyed the existing books of secular Hebrew history. In doing so they ascribed their own behavior to God giving man a conflicted and false view of God.

Jesus Christ revealed the Father to man while on earth. As a byproduct of his incarnation he proved the Jews erroneous self important conclusions about the Messiah to be inaccurate.

Man might fear a great and terrible God, but he will only truly love a good God.

1213 · May 8, 2015

daq said:
Exodus 4:24-26 LXX-Septuagint
24 ἐγένετο δὲ ἐν τῇ ὁδῷ ἐν τῷ καταλύματι συνήντησεν αὐτῷ ἄγγελος Κυρίου καὶ ἐζήτει αὐτὸν ἀποκτεῖναι.
25 καὶ λαβοῦσα Σεπφώρα ψῆφον περιέτεμε τὴν ἀκροβυστίαν τοῦ υἱοῦ αὐτῆς καὶ προσέπεσε πρὸς τοὺς πόδας αὐτοῦ καὶ εἶπεν· ἔστη τὸ αἷμα τῆς περιτομῆς τοῦ παιδίου μου.
26 καὶ ἀπῆλθεν ἀπ᾿ αὐτοῦ, διότι εἶπεν· ἔστη τὸ αἷμα τῆς περιτομῆς τοῦ παιδίου μου.

Exodus 4:24-26
24. And it came to pass that [the] Angel of YHWH met him by the way, in the inn, and sought to slay him.
25. And Sepphora having taken a pebble-stone circumcised the foreskin of her son, and fell at his feet, [the Angel] and said, "The blood of the circumcision of my child-son is staunched!"
26. And he departed from him, because she said, "The blood of the circumcision of my child-son is staunched!"

Thank you very much, good point. Definitely sets that in more understandable meaning.

AlephBet · May 8, 2015

Colter said:
The scriptures were written by holy men, some more holy than others. In them God is created in mans own image, that's why he has many of the emotions and attributes of man.

In Babylon the Hebrew priest rewrote the OT books and destroyed the existing books of secular Hebrew history. In doing so they ascribed their own behavior to God giving man a conflicted and false view of God.

Jesus Christ revealed the Father to man while on earth. As a byproduct of his incarnation he proved the Jews erroneous self important conclusions about the Messiah to be inaccurate.

Man might fear a great and terrible God, but he will only truly love a good God.

I relate to many of the things you say here. Indeed, we are the image of the one that made us. What he sees in us is what he sees in himself. We each have the same deficiency. Is God deficient? No. His image in the Son must, by default, reside first in chaos. From this chaos, the Son works his way back to the Father, learning as he goes. A Father raises a Son. We ARE that Son. All things, including rulers, powers and authorities.

What am I defining here? Father is Aleph Bet (Letters like DNA). Son is Word. Creation is an image that will be remade. Again, what are we defining?

A created hologram in simulation. Updates to follow.

AlephBet · May 8, 2015

daq said:
"Anabatehode!", (third heaven and Paradise) even as Paul learned it from the Revelation of Yeshua, (11). For when the nations not having the Law do by nature the things of the Law; those not having the Law are unto themselves a law, who show forth the work of the law written in their hearts: the inner law jointly witnessing-testifying together with their conscience unto them, and between one another the resulting thoughts Accusing or even making a defense in the Day when Elohim shall judge the secrets of men according to the good message I have received through Revelation of Messiah Yeshua. No one outsmarts the Great Psychologist who made us all. Your conscience is like one of two witnesses and and your inner law is the other; and if your conscience is guilty then your own resulting thoughts will be your Accuser. Therefore Yeshua says, Go, and sin no more, lest a worse thing come to you, (for the unclean spirit cast out goes through dry-desert places like a scapegoat in the wilderness, seeking rest and fining none; and then he goes and gets seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and the eighth is of the seven). In the End YHWH is going to kill that half of you that is killing you; and if you overcome in that day you will rejoice in the afterglow.

Is Salvation arising from our own understanding, work or merit? Are we the savior? How, then, does our own ability or inability contribute or detract from the job of the Savior of Creation? If I were capable of being the Savior, I would. If I were capable of losing my salvation, I would. I can do neither. How, then, does my understanding or lack thereof determine my future state of being? Satan was Arum (Clothed with Knowledge) and man was Naked (Arummim). Who is accountable? Who made Satan Arum? Who divided Adam's image, deceiving the weaker nature of Eve?

All roads lead back to the Lord of Hosts, the head of the body and the one at the right hand of God moving the body. We have little to do with a determined and known destiny. We are merely the puppets on the string of a divine comedy / tragedy. Our reasoning of God cannot change the destiny of improper intent. Intent is by design. If you are not elect, then you are destined for a state of being that is not in your control. Same for the elect.

I believe the point is to overcome the one keeping us in subjection to his own sin nature. We followed him here. We can also reject the wrong choice we made. We are fallen for a reason. Right there beside us was the one that divided our nature in half. He didn't subdue the enemy. He made the enemy.

JeffTheLearner · May 23, 2015

The implication here is the evil doctrine of Maricon, called Mariconism.

400 years YHVH waited for the sons of Cainan to repent while His servants dwelt as slaves in Egypt ...and then came judgment, just as that of Sodom but through His servants.

But also of those who came out of Egypt, they failed to understand that YHVH was in their midts, and many suffered death because their sin was in His Face and was a disregarding of His holiness before the peoples of Yah.

No, you are thinking erroneously, death and judgment comes to all who sin without repentance, and if such deeds seems unpious to you, then what about the judgment on the whole world which is to come???

If you fearfully respect Yah you must repent of this evil exaltation because you may not know it, but you have exalted your own righteousness above that of YHVH's. This is blasphemy ...but done in ignorance, so please repent.

interpreter · May 24, 2015

The God of the Old Testament often ordered His followers to attack and kill surrounding armies. And the God of the OT is the God of the NT. Jesus said He came to bring a sword, and He commanded us to kill His enemies (See Matthew 10:34 and Luke 19:27). Christians have been killing the enemies of Jesus as commanded since 312 AD when the sign of the Son of Man appeared in the clouds, and Jesus came into power through St. Constantine who rode a pale horse and conquered with a bow. The US, founded by George Washington who rode a pale horse, is the fourth horseman to rule the earth for Jesus and, in numerous wars, kill His enemies. We are now dropping 100-pound "hailstones" on the 7th head of the beast in the Battle of Ar Mageddon which began on 9/11 when the Euphrates was dry.

imehkbeetz · May 25, 2015

AlephBet said:
Let me start by saying that I believe Yahweh exists. I also believe that he sent Jesus to die on a cross. I do not doubt this. What I do doubt is his intent. I do not agree with our Lord's desire for war. His intent (by design) is unholy.

Should we worship a warlord? I recently woke up to this deception and no longer worship this evil. My question for you is this: How can you worship this, knowing that he made Satan in Genesis 3:1? What can you say that would convince me this is righteous? Before I walk away from this completely, convince me this is Love. Show me why Yahweh fights the very enemy he made. Why should we support this madness?

Exodus 15:3
Yahweh is a warrior! Yahweh is his name.

Exodus 17:16
He said, “Because a hand was lifted against Yah’s throne, Yahweh will be at war against the Amalekites from one generation to the next.”

Numbers 21:14
This is how it’s described in the Book of the Wars of Yahweh: &#8220;. . . Waheb in Suphah and the valleys,

Numbers 31:3
Moses said to the people, “Some of your men must get ready to go to war against the Midianites. Yahweh will use them to get even with Midian.

Numbers 31:7
They went to war against Midian, as Yahweh commanded Moses, and killed every man.

People can be collected as a tax...

Numbers 31:28
Collect a tax for Yahweh. From the soldiers who served in the war collect one out of every 500 things. This includes people, cattle, donkeys, sheep, and goats.

Deuteronomy 4:34
Or has any god ever tried to come and take one nation away from another for himself? Yahweh your Elohim used his mighty hand and powerful arm to do this for you in Egypt. He did this using plagues, miraculous signs, amazing things, and war. He did his great and awe-inspiring deeds in front of you.

Judges 3:1
These are the nations Yahweh left behind to test all the Israelites who had not experienced any war in Canaan.

And finally, Jesus claims the same:

Revelation 19:11 - I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and wages war.

Yahweh's desire is to make war on heaven itself, then rule from Earth:

Isaiah 24

On that day Yahweh will punish heaven’s armies in heaven
and earth’s kings on earth.
22 They’ll be gathered like prisoners in a jail
and locked in prison.
After a long time they’ll be punished.
23 The moon will be embarrassed.
The sun will be ashamed,
because Yahweh Tsebaoth will rule
on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem.
He will be glorious
in the presence of his respected leaders.

I have concluded this: If you are looking for the source of suffering in the world, look no further than Yahweh and the Satan he made. What would you say to me to justify this Warlord's actions? The nations are clearly deceived by division. Unless someone can justify this as love, our enemy is the one who made Satan Cunning (Arum). Mankind is still naked (Arummim). Wordplay seems to suggest that Yahweh is the one we must overcome.

What do you say to me in defense of this? If Yahweh's just war comes to your country, will you bless his holy name? I believe that it must be possible to defend Yahweh if he is good and that an answer must come from those who worship him. This thread should get many responses if defense of Yahweh's intent is possible. Are you willing to make war in heaven against the armies of heaven with Yahweh? I will not. I know him by his fruit. Love keeps no record of wrongs if you believe Paul. If you believe 1 John 1, God is Love.

Is Yahweh love?

BTW: These verses are NOT out of context to the topic of war as a righteous method of eduction. War is the central theme of Yahweh's use of bloodshed against this verse:

Genesis 9

6 Whoever sheds human blood,
by humans his blood will be shed,
because in his image, Elohim made humans.

Was HIS messiah's blood shed by human hands? Yes. Elohim is not Yahweh. Yahweh made himself the Elohim of Israel. One nation is not the promise of blessing to the NATIONS (Rainbow) that came next in Genesis 9.

What do I believe? I believe there is a true God that will stomp Yahweh in the end. How? By showing us his error. God can only give. When he gives us knowledge, we will overcome with Spirit. God will take nothing. What he gives will clothe us with true righteousness. That righteousness has nothing to do with war. Thieves take. God gives.

Did Yahweh take?

Know the truth. Be set free from the error. Your turn. Defend Yahweh if you worship him. Show me how I am wrong.

You sound like a gnostic luciferian. Like a lot. They believe Satan is the unknowable gods messenger sent to save the world from Jehovah, a supposedly false god trying to steal worship from the unknowable god. They pretty much give Satan God's spot and God Satan's spot. Gnosis is not knowledge.

Yahweh the Warlord - Just Killings

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