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People have different views regarding the atonement. Please give non-Mormons the LDS perspective.
Do YOU want to know the answer to your own question Phoebe? What interest does this subject have for you?People have different views regarding the atonement. Please give non-Mormons the LDS perspective.
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14 And since man had fallen he could not merit anything of himself; but the sufferings and death of Christ atone for their sins, through faith and repentance, and so forth; and that he breaketh the bands of death, that the grave shall have no victory, and that the sting of death should be swallowed up in the hopes of glory; and Aaron did expound all these things unto the king.
There is no contradiction here. A person must believe in Christ in order to be saved (John 3:16). It would be quite anti-Biblical for us to believe that salvation occurs any other way.Thank you, withwonderingawe.
That's a smidgeon. Would you care to expand? And can you tell us why the D&C and your leaders contradict the point about man being unable to merit anything of himself?
D&C 130
19 And if a person gains more knowledge and intelligence in this life through his diligence and obedience than another, he will have so much the advantage in the world to come.
20 There is a law, irrevocably decreed in heaven before the foundations of this world, upon which all blessings are predicated—
21 And when we obtain any blessing from God, it is by obedience to that law upon which it is predicated.
Verse 21 is saying that you have to earn every blessing. It's kind of like earning a merit badge.
D&C 82
10 I, the Lord, am bound when ye do what I say; but when ye do not what I say, ye have no promise.
“The demands of justice for broken law can be satisfied through mercy, earned by your continual repentance and obedience to the laws of God. Such repentance and obedience are absolutely essential for the Atonement to work its complete miracle in your life.”
Mormon Apostle Richard G. Scott, “The Atonement Can Secure Your Peace and Happiness,” Ensign (Conference Edition), November 2006, p.42
Thank you, withwonderingawe.
That's a smidgeon. Would you care to expand? And can you tell us why the D&C and your leaders contradict the point about man being unable to merit anything of himself?
D&C 130
19 And if a person gains more knowledge and intelligence in this life through his diligence and obedience than another, he will have so much the advantage in the world to come.
20 There is a law, irrevocably decreed in heaven before the foundations of this world, upon which all blessings are predicated—
21 And when we obtain any blessing from God, it is by obedience to that law upon which it is predicated.
Verse 21 is saying that you have to earn every blessing. It's kind of like earning a merit badge.
D&C 82
10 I, the Lord, am bound when ye do what I say; but when ye do not what I say, ye have no promise.
“The demands of justice for broken law can be satisfied through mercy, earned by your continual repentance and obedience to the laws of God. Such repentance and obedience are absolutely essential for the Atonement to work its complete miracle in your life.”
Mormon Apostle Richard G. Scott, “The Atonement Can Secure Your Peace and Happiness,” Ensign (Conference Edition), November 2006, p.42
We Christians don't, but the mormon religion teaches that more is required from people for the remission of sins. As Phoebe quoted:Do you have another way for the remission of sins?
But your mormon religion adds to this. We agree a person must believe and have a belief unto repentance. That's it. Your religion adds that one must work continually and be under law. Your religion teaches against Grace, which is the New Covenant. That's what Christianity is - belief in the New Covenant, which is Grace.There is no contradiction here. A person must believe in Christ in order to be saved (John 3:16). It would be quite anti-Biblical for us to believe that salvation occurs any other way.
So you which of following foundations do you believe are not required for a disciple of Christ:We Christians don't, but the mormon religion teaches that more is required from people for the remission of sins. As Phoebe quoted:
“The demands of justice for broken law can be satisfied through mercy, earned by your continual repentance and obedience to the laws of God. Such repentance and obedience are absolutely essential for the Atonement to work its complete miracle in your life.”
Mormon Apostle Richard G. Scott, “The Atonement Can Secure Your Peace and Happiness,” Ensign (Conference Edition), November 2006, p.42
Mormonism teaches that you must at least in part "earn" your salvation and do so by works, i.e. "continual repentance and obedience". Christians believe that obedience to the laws of God are not necessary for salvation but rather will be the natural outcome of a true repentance, and that true repentance (for salvation) happens once.
All of them, and they all happen togetherSo you which of following foundations do you believe are not required for a disciple of Christ:
Faith
Repentance
Baptism
Actually there are Christian groups who proclaim that belief in Christ is not required for salvation, let alone repentance.We agree a person must believe and have a belief unto repentance. That's it.
Horrible "additions" to the the Gospel like that a disciple of Christ must be baptized (Acts 2:38)? Many Christian groups preach against this.Your religion adds that one must work continually and be under law. Your religion teaches against Grace, which is the New Covenant. That's what Christianity is - belief in the New Covenant, which is Grace.
Following the Bible makes one not a "Christian", according to you?Mormonism rejects grace and rejects Christ's sacrifice as being sufficient to cover ALL sin. That's why mormonism is not Christian.
Who? Certainly no orthodox Christians, but rather religious groups that co-opt the name "Christian" incorrectly (like mormons like to do).Actually there are Christian groups who proclaim that belief in Christ is not required for salvation, let alone repentance.
No, additions like the one I quoted from your Apostle as quoted in your Church publication, i.e. that one must work under the law to earn his or her salvation. Didn't you read that? Or are you ignoring it because you can't answer for it???Horrible "additions" to the the Gospel like that a disciple of Christ must be baptized (Acts 2:38)? Many Christian groups preach against this.
Wrong. I didn't say that and I don't know where you came up with that. It's the opposite - following the Bible makes one a Christian (because it includes faith and repentance).Following the Bible makes one not a "Christian", according to you?
I would invite you to ask the OP (Phoebe) if she agrees with you that the works of faith, repentance, and baptism are all required for salvation.All of them, and they all happen together
MANY solo fide groups. Example: Phoebe.Who? Certainly no orthodox Christians, but rather religious groups that co-opt the name "Christian" incorrectly (like mormons like to do).
I'm not ignoring it, but talking about the things he's talking about that, such as repentance is required for salvation. To quote the Articles of Faith (actual LDS scripture) " 4 We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remissionof sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost."No, additions like the one I quoted from your Apostle as quoted in your Church publication, i.e. that one must work under the law to earn his or her salvation. Didn't you read that? Or are you ignoring it because you can't answer for it???
.
Because LDS believe the Bible and that a person should should participate in salvation- things like having faith, repenting, being baptized. You called us "non-Christian" for believing the Bible.Wrong. I didn't say that and I don't know where you came up with that. It's the opposite - following the Bible makes one a Christian (because it includes faith and repentance).
Phoebe is not a group, she is a person. So your claim is wrong, as I said earlier. [Staff edit].MANY solo fide groups. Example: Phoebe.
He's also talking about "earning" by "continual repentance and obedience to the laws of God. In the Articles of Faith you quote above there is nothing about "obedience to the laws of God" but your church teaches it by publishing this teaching from your prophet in an official publication of the church (which can be reached online at this very moment). So, yes, you are ignoring THIS:I'm not ignoring it, but talking about the things he's talking about that, such as repentance is required for salvation. To quote the Articles of Faith (actual LDS scripture) " 4 We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remissionof sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost."
No, I call you non-Christian for believing your church's teachings, specifically the one quoted above, where you are taught (and you must believe in order to be a mormon) that your salvation can be "earned by your continual repentance and obedience to the laws of God" and that "such repentance and obedience are ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL for the Atonement to work its complete miracle in your life".Because LDS believe the Bible and that a person should should participate in salvation- things like having faith, repenting, being baptized. You called us "non-Christian" for believing the Bible.
John 14:15 -Christ says: "If you love me, keep my commandments".No, I call you non-Christian for believing your church's teachings, specifically the one quoted above, where you are taught (and you must believe in order to be a mormon) that your salvation can be "earned by your continual repentance and obedience to the laws of God" and that "such repentance and obedience are ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL for the Atonement to work its complete miracle in your life".
I'm labeling mormons "non-Christian" for disbelieving and not following Christ. That's the point. It's not my choice, it's what the Bible says. Mormons reject the Gospel and are therefore not Christian.John 14:15 -Christ says: "If you love me, keep my commandments".
If you want to label me "non-Christian" for believing & following Christ, then that's your choice.
[Staff edit].I'm labeling mormons "non-Christian" for disbelieving and not following Christ. That's the point. It's not my choice, it's what the Bible says. Mormons reject the Gospel and are therefore not Christian.
We Christians don't, but the mormon religion teaches that more is required from people for the remission of sins. As Phoebe quoted:
“The demands of justice for broken law can be satisfied through mercy, earned by your continual repentance and obedience to the laws of God. Such repentance and obedience are absolutely essential for the Atonement to work its complete miracle in your life.”
Mormon Apostle Richard G. Scott, “The Atonement Can Secure Your Peace and Happiness,” Ensign (Conference Edition), November 2006, p.42
Mormonism teaches that you must at least in part "earn" your salvation and do so by works, i.e. "continual repentance and obedience". Christians believe that obedience to the laws of God are not necessary for salvation but rather will be the natural outcome of a true repentance, and that true repentance (for salvation) happens once.