I don't believe in evolution... (2)

TheReasoner

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I am disappointed to see you using Straw Man exaggerations also. You are well aware that I only advocate execution under Civil Law. Also, an execution is not a killing.
Do you think the victims of an execution walks away from the event Clirus?

Execution means you kill the person you're executing dead. It doesn't mean you tickle them or look sternly at them.

Look the word up in a dictionary Clirus:
dictionary said:
kill 1 |kil|
verb [ trans. ]
1 cause the death of (a person, animal, or other living thing)
But lets look at what the Bible says about a man that will not support his children.

I Timothy 5:8 states, "But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel."
Doesn't say he should die for that.
What do you do when you read that statement? Too many Christians do nothing. At the very least a Christian should rebuke a person that fails to provide for his own, and if the person is fails to change, then execution under Civil Law is appropriate.
And what good would that do? Why this focus on killing everyone?
I will now go back to the statement, "The only thing necessary for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing."
Sure. You know what else works for evil to flourish? Someone confusing it with good. Like you're doing.
I would suggest you are advocating doing nothing relative to what the Bible says about a man that fails to provide for is own.
America has a 40% illegitimacy rate because people refuse to rebuke sin, or take the John Edwards approach to sin.

Source? How does this compare to the less Christian nations Clirus? How does this compare between conservative and liberal states in the US?

Check this map on divorce rates in the US: Divorce Rate by state. Definition, graph and map.
Also, check teenage pregnancies:
Teen Birth Rate per 1,000 (most recent) by state

Even though evil can be tolerated, it should be rebuked, and advocating evil should be rejected. Advocating evil can be anything from portraying an evil activity as fun with no consequences to the John Edwards attitude that "I would not do it, but I would not be bothered if others did it".

So.. Are you surprised we rebuke you because of your evil ways?

I seriously question that God will accept the silence of Christians that should be the light, but rather hide it under a basket.
Hence I don't let your support of evil pass without comment :wave:

Christians should warn people (be salt and light),
Yet you refuse any admonition anyone gives you. Which is not proper christian behavior, is it?
Civil Law should control, restrict, destroy, force, etc. people.
And how does history tell us that works Clirus?

Christians should advocate that which is good and healthy for society as described in the Bible.
Yet you ignore much to most of what the new testament says and even much of the old testament. Even to the point of direct contradiction.

Civil Law should control, restrict, destroy, force, etc. that which is harmful (disease, death, destruction and poverty) to society.
Do you want to execute the poor too Clirus?
Congress (as the representatives of the people) defines Civil Law. If the laws that Congress defines are consistent with the Christian Lifestyle (God's Law), the people who practice evil will suffer.
"Judge not lest ye be judged", "Love your enemies", "Do onto others as you would have them do onto you"
Ring a bell?

If the laws that Congress defines are consistent with the Atheistic Lifestyle, everyone will suffer.
But... We formed our nation on such laws. Laws which we built on the bible, though you would certainly call them evil as they are often in direct contradiction to your ways. And now we're at the top of the HDI. We don't suffer from it, in fact it's the exact opposite.
I say that your position is anti-christian and highly destructive.
Civil Law consistent with the Atheistic Lifestyle cause suffering for everyone because the Christens suffer under the law, and the Atheists suffer because of the sin the law allows. Romans 6:23 states, "For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
And yet you embrace sin like a drowning man would a piece of driftwood. Clinging to it as if it was your savior. Only in your case it's not a log, it's a crocodile.
And we wonder what is wrong with America. Matthew 5:13 states, "Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? It is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under the foot of men."

And you know what's really funny about that? The more you guys lean towards your conservative side the worse it gets. Oh sure you blame the liberals at every bend and turn, but why does the exact same thing show itself in other nations? When conservatives come to power there's often some destructive consequence. Esp. if these conservatives are like you are.

Clirus, if you were right your position - which has been tried at several points in history - would have produced better nations and better systems. It has not. It has led to hunger, strife, war, revolutions and other atrocious things.
 
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Charlie V

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Do you want to execute the poor too Clirus?

Clirus did say that a man who cannot provide for his family should be executed. I believe a poor man would be an example of a man who cannot provide for his family. Not to mention men with certain health issues making him incapable of work.

Charlie
 
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TheReasoner

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Clirus did say that a man who cannot provide for his family should be executed. I believe a poor man would be an example of a man who cannot provide for his family. Not to mention men with certain health issues making him incapable of work.

Charlie

True, that. Goodness gracious. Not only does Clirus want to take this far, she apparently thinks it's OK to take it much farther than Sodom and Gomorrah did (Read Ezekiel and tell me why those cities fell according to ol. Ez.)
Not only does she not want to care for the poor - which we already knew - she wants to kill them. Oh, pardon. Execute. (Which still means to kill, Clirus)
 
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HosannaHM

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Response

Are you aware the concept of loving those that persecute you is an attitude which Christians should have, but not a commandment. Are you aware that forgiving 77 times is a concept of a Christian forgiving another Christian.

John 15:10-12 states, "If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love. These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full. This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you"

The commandment to love one another is for Christians to love fellow Christians. The only love to be shown to nonbelievers is to offer them salvation.

What kind of fruit are you bearing? In the past 60 years America has become a haven of Socialism and Atheism. Someone is not doing their job as a Christian by presenting God to the world.

Is it adequate that you read in the Bible that something is a sin, but that you never testify to that statement in the Bible.

Even though evil can be tolerated, it should be rebuked, and advocating evil should be rejected. Advocating evil can be anything from portraying an evil activity as fun with no consequences to the John Edwards attitude that "I would not do it, but I would not be bothered if others did it". inappropriate contentography should be rejected because it advocates evil.

James 2:17 states, "Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone."


Yeah i read your scripture post the first time. So in my previous post you chose to address the parts you wanted to (taking those out of context for the most part) and refusing any type of correction.

I can see that this is not helping you. If anything stop posting, because you are a negative influence both on Christians and Non-Christians.

I don't advocate evil; it's the very reason I'm addressing your hate-filled comments.

Works are nice, but are you working for the will of Christ, or your own?

We should correct the sin, not condemn the sinner
 
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tulc

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This reminds me of the Westboro Baptist Church. We are all united against them, whether we are Christian or atheist, gay or straight. In this manner, we all unite against Clirus.

To be honest, I'm not against cliris, I'm against her misuse of Scripture. :wave:
tulc(thinks cliris sounds a lot like some members if his family) :sorry:
 
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Charlie V

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To be honest, I'm not against cliris, I'm against her misuse of Scripture. :wave:

I'm against the proposition that we should "execute" so many people.

I'm against the death penalty even for the reasons deemed acceptable by death-penalty advocates.

Some of the reasons given to "execute" people, here, make me go: :tutu:
 
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TheReasoner

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This reminds me of the Westboro Baptist Church. We are all united against them, whether we are Christian or atheist, gay or straight. In this manner, we all unite against Clirus.

I've wondered if Clirus might be a part of that "church".
 
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Lion Hearted Man

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To be honest, I'm not against cliris, I'm against her misuse of Scripture. :wave:
tulc(thinks cliris sounds a lot like some members if his family) :sorry:

semantics; "against" meaning "standing in opposition of", and referring exclusively to clirus' ideas and not existence

I've wondered if Clirus might be a part of that "church".

totally possible. though they usually announce who they are because they love the attention.
 
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rjc34

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We should correct the sin, not condemn the sinner

This is the main problem with Clirus' posts... Her manifesto is ether correct the sin, or if that fails execute the individual.

What do you propose for those who do not follow your command to 'correct' their 'sins'?
 
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Nathan Poe

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All Atheists should be rebuked, and some that are a threat to society should be executed under Civil Law. A passive Atheist should only be rebuked.

Go ahead and rebuke me, clirus -- I triple-dog-dare you.

You and I do not agree on the concept of a neighbor. Your concept of neighbor considers Atheist and Christians to be equal in the sight of God.

And that's why you reject Jesus -- because he doesn't consider you any better than anyone else.
 
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Zongerfield

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Ohnonono! Not by your church at all. Only Jesus has the power to save. Your church has no such power. He was saved by Jesus and by HIS power, your church was Christ's tool but it in itself cannot save anyone.

Did I say it was just my church? Or did I say it was my church along with the power and grace of God?

Yes, my church is a conduit for the Lord, as am I. His power, his grace, his righteousness flows through many people, especially those individuals who have a special covenant with the Lord. I believe I am one of those people. In fact, my experience has confirmed this. Am I powerless without his divinity, you betcha, but he has blessed me to do his work, and I gleefully accept the task.


And how is this beneficial to Clirus' position who wants to see such people killed, not helped? If Clirus had her way your story would have been "There was this guy called Walt. He committed the sin of pederasty and for that he was publicly executed" - no mercy, no hope.

Walt found the Lord, and was saved. Had he not, execution may have been an appropriate form of punishment. Pederasty is a serious offense that adversely affects many young lives.

Z, why wouldn't we? I've seen similar things happen.

Because you and others seem hell bent on rebuking a fellow Christian. We Christians need to stick together, we don't need to be tearing each other down.

Show me where the bible says the power is ours please. We only have this by the grace of God. When I have prophesied in tongues or spoken in tongues that is not strictly speaking *me* doing so. It's God wanting to use me and me allowing that to happen. I could stop speaking, I could refuse prophesying. But I could never prophesy of my own accord. To do so would not be a prophesy but something else. A lie, I suppose. God needs to be the initiating factor. We're like valves. He needs to supply us with what needs to run through us and we can allow or refuse that. But without His permission no flow will come regardless of how much we open the valve in ourselves.

I agree, and I don't believe I've presented evidence to the contrary. The power is his alone. I am just a vessel for it. I freely admit that.

Do you wanna know what's magical? When you have a group of his vessels operating together in a coordinated effort to save wayward individuals, then you see real power and grace he has. Walt came to me in tears one day, he had a very heavy heart, he had just been released from prison and was being tempted to sin again by the demons within his soul. We read scripture together and prayed together all day to quell his impulses and it worked. It worked like magic.
 
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Nathan Poe

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Did I say it was just my church? Or did I say it was my church along with the power and grace of God?

Yes, my church is a conduit for the Lord, as am I. His power, his grace, his righteousness flows through many people, especially those individuals who have a special covenant with the Lord. I believe I am one of those people. In fact, my experience has confirmed this. Am I powerless without his divinity, you betcha, but he has blessed me to do his work, and I gleefully accept the task.

It would appear that His divinity doesn't carry very well over an internet connection, since you're pretty powerless here as well.

Surely the Almighty can handle broadband?

Walt found the Lord, and was saved. Had he not, execution may have been an appropriate form of punishment. Pederasty is a serious offense that adversely affects many young lives.

So because he "found Jesus," he is exempt for punishment for his crimes?

Because you and others seem hell bent on rebuking a fellow Christian. We Christians need to stick together, we don't need to be tearing each other down.
[

Solidarity at all costs, then?


Do you wanna know what's magical? When you have a group of his vessels operating together in a coordinated effort to save wayward individuals, then you see real power and grace he has. Walt came to me in tears one day, he had a very heavy heart, he had just been released from prison and was being tempted to sin again by the demons within his soul. We read scripture together and prayed together all day to quell his impulses and it worked. It worked like magic.

So where was the group? Sounds like you soloed this one.
 
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Zongerfield

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It would appear that His divinity doesn't carry very well over an internet connection, since you're pretty powerless here as well.

Surely the Almighty can handle broadband?

So because he "found Jesus," he is exempt for punishment for his crimes?

Solidarity at all costs, then?

So where was the group? Sounds like you soloed this one.

But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea that is driven and tossed by the wind. - James 1:6.

If you are willing, and if you are up for the challenge, I have a proposition to make to you.

Tonight, at 10:00 pm EST, pray to our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Ask him for mercy, ask him for forgiveness, and ask him to restore your faith in his power and his grace. And if after your prayer, you don't feel even the slightest bit touched, ie the hairs on the back of your neck don't stand up, or if you don't sense a prickling in your inner-consciousness, than you can forsake the Lord and ask him to damn you to hell.

Does this sound like a fair proposition? I think so. In return for your participation, I will pray for you and forgive you for your sins against me and my ilk.

Bless you. The Lord will hear you tonight and answer you if you let him into your heart.
 
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sdmsanjose

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Quote of Clirus
I am disappointed to see you using Straw Man exaggerations also. You are well aware that I only advocate execution under Civil Law. Also, an execution is not a killing.

Clirus
Stop with the (execution-Killing) word games!


Quote of Clirus
But lets look at what the Bible says about a man that will not support his children.

I Timothy 5:8 states, "But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel."

What do you do when you read that statement? Too many Christians do nothing. At the very least a Christian should rebuke a person that fails to provide for his own, and if the person is fails to change, then execution under Civil Law is appropriate


You say to look at what the Bible says and your own Bible quote proves your position is not supported by the Bible. The Bible said NOTHING about executing a man that does not provide for his own. Are you blind to the words of the Bible?

You have for years condemned all kinds of groups and people on this forum for years. I cannot even remember them all but the few that I can name are Environmentalist, Atheist Agnostics, Blacks, War protestors, pacifists, death penalty opponents, socialist, Democrats, liberal Christians, the poor, the Catholic Church, and Christian leaders of America.

Do you really think that God appointed you to pronounce condemnation to people that do not agree with you?

You try to manipulate the teachings of Jesus to support your political ideas and condemnations of all sorts of people. Furthermore, you put yourself in the position of God by judging so many people and fail to emphasize the main theme of the scriptures. You claim to rely on scriptures but your posts for that last several years have not emphasized the greatest teaching of Christ.

1 Corinthians 13:13
And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.
 
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Nathan Poe

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If you are willing, and if you are up for the challenge, I have a proposition to make to you.

Tonight, at 10:00 pm EST, pray to our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Ask him for mercy, ask him for forgiveness, and ask him to restore your faith in his power and his grace. And if after your prayer, you don't feel even the slightest bit touched, ie the hairs on the back of your neck don't stand up, or if you don't sense a prickling in your inner-consciousness, than you can forsake the Lord and ask him to damn you to hell.

Did it. Felt nothing.

And since, according to the likes of you and clirus, I'm already damned to hell, it seems quite pointless to "ask" for something I'm already getting. Might as well ask God to let May follow April.

Does this sound like a fair proposition? I think so. In return for your participation, I will pray for you and forgive you for your sins against me and my ilk.

Whatever works for you.

Bless you. The Lord will hear you tonight and answer you if you let him into your heart.

Looks like He didn't -- and if the end result of that would be to become like you and/or clirus, then I'm better off. The heart cannot accept what the mind rejects.
 
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tulc

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But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea that is driven and tossed by the wind. - James 1:6.

If you are willing, and if you are up for the challenge, I have a proposition to make to you.

Tonight, at 10:00 pm EST, pray to our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Ask him for mercy, ask him for forgiveness, and ask him to restore your faith in his power and his grace. And if after your prayer, you don't feel even the slightest bit touched, ie the hairs on the back of your neck don't stand up, or if you don't sense a prickling in your inner-consciousness, than you can forsake the Lord and ask him to damn you to hell.

Does this sound like a fair proposition? I think so. In return for your participation, I will pray for you and forgive you for your sins against me and my ilk.

Bless you. The Lord will hear you tonight and answer you if you let him into your heart.

uhmmm about the bolded portion? What sins has Nathan Poe committed against you? Or your ilk for that matter? :confused:
tulc(unless...simply disagreeing with you is a sin?) :sorry:
 
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Nathan Poe

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uhmmm about the bolded portion? What sins has Nathan Poe committed against you? Or your ilk for that matter? :confused:
tulc(unless...simply disagreeing with you is a sin?) :sorry:

I think you've answered your own question, tulc.

In any event, seeing as how the rebuke has failed, my execution can't be far behind.
 
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tulc

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I think you've answered your own question, tulc.

In any event, seeing as how the rebuke has failed, my execution can't be far behind.

Oh man that stinks! :sigh:
uhmmmm...can I have your stuff?
tulc(just wondering) :sorry:
 
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